Forums - Garou owns Streeth Figther 3 Show all 121 posts from this thread on one page Forums (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/index.php) - Fighting Game Discussion (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=8) -- Garou owns Streeth Figther 3 (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=18146) Posted by PrOzErG on 05:12:2001 01:07 PM: Streeth figther 3 is not bad but I must admit that Garou on Neo is much much much better so Streeth figther 3 sucks ! Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:12:2001 01:12 PM: AMEN!, SF3 IS THE SAME CRAP, HOW MANY THREE'S DO YOU NEED BEFORE YOU REALIZE CAPCOM IS THE BIGGEST STEREOTYPE COMPANY AROUND. Posted by shin srwilson on 05:12:2001 01:29 PM: I think both games are good in theair own ways but i do prefer Street Fighter 3 3rd strike. Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:12:2001 01:31 PM: Lets take a look at the very "original" capcom SF timeline sf2 sf2 champion edition sf2 bootlegs ssf2 ssf2 X sf the movie sf alpha sf alpha 2 sf alpha 3 then theres gold.... sf3 (damn they didnt studder to three) sf3 second impact sf 3 third strike sf ex plus alpha sf ex 2 sf ex 3 sf ex this is just naming a couple, damn if I were a capcom fan I would feel cheated right about now..... And then there is the endless character ripps made for the ultra easy to become and expert at vs series.....It kills me everytime!!!!! lets check out fatal fury ff1 ff2 ffs ff3 ffrb ffrbs ffrb2 garou...and wild ambition Wow it seems that FF actually takes some skill, good luck capcommies. And SNK doesnt suffer from sequalitis as bad as capcom, I think its about time that they made a newer shoto, OH SHIT DIDNT SEE THAT ONE COMING AHAHAHHAA!!!!! Oh crap! SNK had no pallette swap characters, they actually have to put work into there product!!!!! we have akuma, ryu, evil ryu, ken, sean ,dan, (aof rip off) whos next in the long line of the same character with different hair and clothes color.... Ryu, how original a character with a headband and a GI, LOL.... So while you guys are waiting for street fighter 3 minus a negative alpha plus omega, we have kof 2001 on the way! HAHAHA. Its amazing you need a title like a quadratic formula just to kick some ass, but if thats your only choice mash away heathens! How long can capcom profit off of the same damn thing over and over...I feel sorry for you guys.. Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:12:2001 01:41 PM: quote: Originally posted by shin srwilson I think both games are good in theair own ways but i do prefer Street Fighter 3 3rd strike. No offence man, but look at gouki and ken and ryu, all alpha pallette swaps... Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:12:2001 01:43 PM: Its all a matter of quality over quantity. Posted by shin srwilson on 05:12:2001 01:44 PM: Gouki is the most awesome fighter ever and hes my killer street fighter i destroy all with him so dont diss him and as for Ryu and Ken they will always be famous Characters and be 2 of the most popular fighters ever. Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:12:2001 01:52 PM: Gouki looks just like the others put them all in one still frame. Pallette swaps are a company laziness, look at mvsc2 no endings not even in capcom vs snk, what did they do they ripped there characters from the alpha series and sf3 series....They made the SNK characters look sick, Geese looks retarded in his capcom drawing.... heck all characters do. I got alot of balls taken this to the worst place possible, but im damn tired of hearing sf was first FF was in development long before street fighter. The only cool characters capcom has in there sf series is vega and remy thats it! Posted by Gimpy on 05:12:2001 03:05 PM: Motw is good. I enjoy it but Street Fighter 3, 3S, is a little better than Motw because Motw borrows from SF3 so SF3 is the better of the two. Posted by s†onne on 05:12:2001 04:46 PM: 3rd strike is a better game because of the smooth animation it has, and better parrying system. MOTW is good but it doesn't stand a chance against the pioneer of Street fighter III: 3rd strike. Posted by VManOfMana on 05:12:2001 07:29 PM: Krauzer: do me a favor and shut up. You are not providing anything positive to this thread. Both games are different, and have their own stuff. I play both and I enjoy both. I don't let company zealotism take over the fact that I like both games. Now, if you want to look at things in a biased form... [start stupid bias on] sequelitis? Yeah right. King of Fighters 94 same thing 95 same thing 96 same thing 97 same thing 98 same thing 99 same thing 2000 and now, same thing 2001 or what about Fatal Fury Fatal Fury 2 Fatal Fury Special Fatal Fury 3 Real Bout Fatal Fury ... and you can go and on if you want. [end stupid bias off] So next time, please think before wasting bandwidth, ok? Posted by el_diablo on 05:12:2001 07:56 PM: i think garou is good but street fighter 3 is better (i'm talking about the 2nd impact) because garou duplicates the street 3 game style... i prefer the other Fatal Fury.... especially RBFFS, this game was phat!!! Posted by LOLO on 05:12:2001 10:28 PM: lol... i guess SF3 is better coz i don't even know what the hell Garou is... hehehe... Posted by Kamui on 05:12:2001 10:33 PM: Krauser, Go the fuck away. We already have a hundred SNK fanboys around here like you here for no reason other than to bash Capcom. It really makes me ashamed to even like SNK games when fools like you run rampant.Your here for no reason other than to piss people off, go away. "Oh crap! SNK had no pallette swap characters, they actually have to put work into there product!!!!!" No instead year after year you get pixel swapped versions of the same chr even though people think SNK spent a alot of time changing the costume for that chr. Youll notice that many of the wrinkles in Kyo's clothes are in the exact same spot as the were in his old costume from 98, thats because when creating Kyo's "new" sprite the just slapped the 98 sprite into a program then painted over it, same reason why SNK never bothered to even try and re-animated any of Kyo's regular attacks(except for his standing HK). Hell Ralph and Clark are basically pallette swapped chrs themselves, with minor animation changes bieng added year by year. Lets not mention the fact the Terry Bogard has had the same walking and standing animation he had since KOF 96. To amke things worse, people are under the impression that SNK's chr designs are original, when people havent noticed that Kyo, Iori, Rock, Terry Bogard, and Keade were all built under the same ground work. It shows too, youll notice that they have a lot of things in common, for starters they all have projectiles that travel across the ground(or had in Kyo's case), the all have vests/jackets with undershirts, there all pretty boys(Terry just joining the pretty club with his new MOTW outfit), and the ALL have a symbol of some sort on there back that represents there chr isn some way. SNK chr designs original? Maybe when KOF originally came out, but not anymore and never again. Everythings been done. "So while you guys are waiting for street fighter 3 minus a negative alpha plus omega, we have kof 2001 on the way!" Yes, a new KOF game done by a Korean company, and not SNK themselves. Korea knows there 3D fighters, Korea knows there PC games but its a fact that 2D fighter arent very popular over there, what makes you think a Korean company thats never done a 2D fighter before(to my knowledge)will know what there doing AT ALL? "lets check out fatal fury ff1 ff2 ffs ff3 ffrb ffrbs ffrb2 garou...and wild ambition Wow it seems that FF actually takes some skill, good luck capcommies." Considering the first FF and FF2 were pure garabage i seriosuly dont know how your able to make that comment. THe original SF2 owns them all easily. FF takes skill eh? Well considering your a SNK fan who deosnt play Capcom fighters (why would you? Oh wait, let me guess, you hate the games but you paly them anyways? yeah right)you wouldnt know jack shit about Capcom fighters to begin with. Go back to neo-geo.com and talk about SNK games, Ill gladly join in. But these pointless flames posts from SNK fans on a Capcom based site is getting on my nerves. Posted by Kamui on 05:12:2001 10:38 PM: [QUOTE]Originally posted by VManOfMana "Fatal Fury Fatal Fury 2 Fatal Fury Special Fatal Fury 3 Real Bout Fatal Fury" You forget Real Bout Fatal Fury Special and RB2. Fatal Fury Special bieng a shameless upgrade to fatal fury 2 and RB special bieng the same for Real Bout. Face it Krauser every company does it. Why do you think they release upgrades? To improve on the games past mistakes to make players happy and to make more money.If SNK fanboys were actually critical about the truly bad SNK fighters(they would say every SNK game is god just to make themselves feel better about the $300 they spent on it), and actually noticed all the bugs, glitches, infinites and such in these games and tell SNK about it then they would release upgrades to the game as well. Hell, considering SNK needs the money right now that would be a good idea. Posted by DA GAME on 05:12:2001 10:41 PM: I like both of games myself but I'm going have to agree with Krauser on a couple of things he explained earlier on this thread.Did anybody here mentioned that SNK's fighting games have a MAJOR 1-up over Capcom & it's important also:A consistent storyline?Foe example MOTW has fans going "What next?".While SF fans are going "What happened to so&so?"Where is so&so?" Posted by Garou on 05:13:2001 12:29 AM: Yes I do OWN SF3! Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 12:46 AM: Yes, a new KOF game done by a Korean company, and not SNK themselves. Korea knows there 3D fighters, Korea knows there PC games but its a fact that 2D fighter arent very popular over there, what makes you think a Korean company thats never done a 2D fighter before(to my knowledge)will know what there doing AT ALL? They're making it under supervision from SNK, remember? Considering the first FF and FF2 were pure garabage Pure garbage that spawned three new serieses of games, three animes, action figures, keychains, six manga serieses, over twenty music CDs, etc. etc. etc. It's interesting though, you are the first person I've seen to say that Fatal Fury 2 was garbage. It was actually outselling SF2 cabinets for a while at one point you know. Then again I guess I can't expect anything better from the person who said taht Last Blade 2 has no strategy i seriosuly dont know how your able to make that comment. THe original SF2 owns them all easily. It's his opinion, and you just made yours, who's to stop him? Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:13:2001 01:37 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui Krauser, Go the fuck away. We already have a hundred SNK fanboys around here like you here for no reason other than to bash Capcom. It really makes me ashamed to even like SNK games when fools like you run rampant.Your here for no reason other than to piss people off, go away. "Oh crap! SNK had no pallette swap characters, they actually have to put work into there product!!!!!" No instead year after year you get pixel swapped versions of the same chr even though people think SNK spent a alot of time changing the costume for that chr. Youll notice that many of the wrinkles in Kyo's clothes are in the exact same spot as the were in his old costume from 98, thats because when creating Kyo's "new" sprite the just slapped the 98 sprite into a program then painted over it, same reason why SNK never bothered to even try and re-animated any of Kyo's regular attacks(except for his standing HK). Hell Ralph and Clark are basically pallette swapped chrs themselves, with minor animation changes bieng added year by year. Lets not mention the fact the Terry Bogard has had the same walking and standing animation he had since KOF 96. To amke things worse, people are under the impression that SNK's chr designs are original, when people havent noticed that Kyo, Iori, Rock, Terry Bogard, and Keade were all built under the same ground work. It shows too, youll notice that they have a lot of things in common, for starters they all have projectiles that travel across the ground(or had in Kyo's case), the all have vests/jackets with undershirts, there all pretty boys(Terry just joining the pretty club with his new MOTW outfit), and the ALL have a symbol of some sort on there back that represents there chr isn some way. SNK chr designs original? Maybe when KOF originally came out, but not anymore and never again. Everythings been done. "So while you guys are waiting for street fighter 3 minus a negative alpha plus omega, we have kof 2001 on the way!" Yes, a new KOF game done by a Korean company, and not SNK themselves. Korea knows there 3D fighters, Korea knows there PC games but its a fact that 2D fighter arent very popular over there, what makes you think a Korean company thats never done a 2D fighter before(to my knowledge)will know what there doing AT ALL? "lets check out fatal fury ff1 ff2 ffs ff3 ffrb ffrbs ffrb2 garou...and wild ambition Wow it seems that FF actually takes some skill, good luck capcommies." Considering the first FF and FF2 were pure garabage i seriosuly dont know how your able to make that comment. THe original SF2 owns them all easily. FF takes skill eh? Well considering your a SNK fan who deosnt play Capcom fighters (why would you? Oh wait, let me guess, you hate the games but you paly them anyways? yeah right)you wouldnt know jack shit about Capcom fighters to begin with. Go back to neo-geo.com and talk about SNK games, Ill gladly join in. But these pointless flames posts from SNK fans on a Capcom based site is getting on my nerves. Your such the idiot, I am entitled to my opinion, and if your ashamed to be and snk fan then take a hike, do you actually think telling me to go away will really make me go away???? MORONIC. Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 01:44 AM: "They're making it under supervision from SNK, remember? " Supervision of SNK? Whats left of SNK? Apparently the have fired more then half there staff. "Pure garbage that spawned three new serieses of games, three animes, action figures, keychains, six manga serieses, over twenty music CDs, etc. etc. etc. It's interesting though, you are the first person I've seen to say that Fatal Fury 2 was garbage. It was actually outselling SF2 cabinets for a while at one point you know. Then again I guess I can't expect anything better from the person who said taht Last Blade 2 has no strategy " Fatal Fury 2 was garbage. I played it a hell of a lot more then i did SF2 when it came out becuase i prefered the chr designs. This bieng around the same time when i didnt even know what a combo, was let alone what a good game was. I have a feeling a large portion of the world was running under that same very mentality when they first though FF2 was a good game. I also dont see tournies still running for the game(other then a group of fanboys at a friends house), not like Super Turbo. About the merchandise you listed, what does that mean? It means SNK tried to sell the idea by producing items and selling them, that deosnt mean people actually bought them. I guess SNK is a company at heart after all, kind of head to tell sometimes Oh and about the last blade 2 comment, i said there is very little strategy involved, not 0. Besides nobody has even attempted to prove me wrong yet, and i dont think it will happen considering that 90% of the people on neo-geo.com still think power mode is good :/ "It's his opinion, and you just made yours, who's to stop him? " OH PLEASE. His opinion is he deosnt like Capcom games and the hes gonna do everything in his power to goto a Capcom based website and start shit for no reason other than to make his dick bigger, sound familiar? The worst part about this is that you people wont even admit that SNK has made bad fighters, really really shitty fighters. Games like AOF(which deosnt even have a following in japan, you wont even be using that as an argument!), and the older FF are just plain not good, but becuase you happened to pay $300 for a cart you wont let it go that the game quite possibly could be terrible. Even i hate a few capcom fighters with a passion(SF3:3rd strike, Rival Schools, SFA, SFA3). Ugh,i seriously dont like the trolling, im getting really tired of it. Rasa, i know why your here, you said yourself that you dont hate everything Capcom, but people who blatently dont like Capcom games like Krauser are here for 0 reason other than to piss Capcom's fans off??? Dont defend him, defend your games, but not him. ] Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 01:47 AM: THIS ISNT EVEN ABOUT OPINION, YOUR USING THAT AS AN EXCUSE TO TROLL!!! YOU DONT LIKE CAPCOM, GO AWAY. YOU SHOULD BE FUCKING BANNED OFR LIFE. Your not here to express a valid opinion your here to anger Capcoms fans. You also didnt even attempt to counter my arguments, your a troller, go away, quit wasting peoples time. quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser Your such the idiot, I am entitled to my opinion, and if your ashamed to be and snk fan then take a hike, do you actually think telling me to go away will really make me go away???? MORONIC. Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:13:2001 01:52 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui THIS ISNT EVEN ABOUT OPINION, YOUR USING THAT AS AN EXCUSE TO TROLL!!! YOU DONT LIKE CAPCOM, GO AWAY. YOU SHOULD BE FUCKING BANNED OFR LIFE. Your not here to express a valid opinion your here to anger Capcoms fans. You also didnt even attempt to counter my arguments, your a troller, go away, quit wasting peoples time. Dont you get it?? Im getting to you, when someone gets to you they are more encouraged to do more... Be happy im hard to get angry. Posted by TalbainEric on 05:13:2001 02:36 AM: quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser AMEN!, SF3 IS THE SAME CRAP, HOW MANY THREE'S DO YOU NEED BEFORE YOU REALIZE CAPCOM IS THE BIGGEST STEREOTYPE COMPANY AROUND. I totally agree with you! I mean,HELLO,most Americans aren't army fighters or thugs,or British people aren't all punks and perfect. C'mon Capcom,come up with better designs!!!!!!!!! I think Garou has some fabulous artwork,and the game plays pretty good,gameplay is not as good as Third Strike,but Garou has more originality. Especially B.Jenet and Freeman,some cool characters. Hey,Kamui,are you the same one from MMCafe? If so,what's up? Posted by Havoc911 on 05:13:2001 02:55 AM: I like both, but I think Garou is better. Forget the fact the Garou is clearly SNK's answer to SFIII (since that is completely irrelevent when comparing games), Garou does everything that SFIII does, plus it adds more. The T.O.P. system is excellent, and the brakes and feint moves add a lot to the game. I love SFIII a lot, but Garou is just better IMO. I can't wait for the DC version. Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 03:55 AM: Im really dont understand what your trying to say, but whatever. quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser Dont you get it?? Im getting to you, when someone gets to you they are more encouraged to do more... Be happy im hard to get angry. Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 04:01 AM: "Hey,Kamui,are you the same one from MMCafe? If so,what's up? " Hi, ive been here for quite a while suprised you didnt notice! Sorry you had to catch me in a bad mood :P "I totally agree with you! I mean,HELLO,most Americans aren't army fighters or thugs,or British people aren't all punks and perfect. C'mon Capcom,come up with better designs!!!!!!!!!" Most americans arent Pirates ether. Posted by Stray on 05:13:2001 04:11 AM: Well, there's just something about Street Fighter, you know? Familiarity, I guess. SNK is always taking characters in and out of their games... I'd get pissed if Capcom did that with my favorite characters. I'm not worried about the amount of work Capcom puts into the characters, it's the gameplay.... I've never played a game more perfect than SFA3. Tons of characters, tons of options, it's the most complete SF game ever. Speaking of work put into characters, I've never seen a Neo Geo game equal the quality of animation found in SF3:3S. Just play what you like, people. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 04:36 AM: Supervision of SNK? Whats left of SNK? Apparently the have fired more then half there staff. It's the staff members who designed KoF99 and 2K plus some of the original team (which had helped make Guilty Gear X with Arc Systems after they left). Fatal Fury 2 was garbage. I played it a hell of a lot more then i did SF2 when it came out becuase i prefered the chr designs. This bieng around the same time when i didnt even know what a combo, was let alone blah blah blah blah blah... Again, this is irrelevant and it's still just YOUR opinion about a game. I guess Mega Man 2 is a shit game because contests aren't still held for it? Or that Super Castlevania 4 is a shit game also because TG stopped excepting win times for it? About the merchandise you listed, what does that mean? It means SNK tried to sell the idea by producing items and selling them, that deosnt mean people actually bought them. I guess SNK is a company at heart after all, kind of head to tell sometimes The merchendise was made AFTER the Fatal Fury series became a hit. The Andy Bogard keychain in my pocket was made after Fatal Fury 3 came out, etc, the mangas were adapted from Takara's retelling of the plots in their SNES ports, etc. Oh and about the last blade 2 comment, i said there is very little strategy involved, not 0. Besides nobody has even attempted to prove me wrong yet, and i dont think it will happen considering that 90% of the people on neo-geo.com still think power mode is good :/ Power mode isn't good, that's why it IS good IMO, because you have to be good to win with it. It's the more technical of the two modes, but I think at the highest skill levels it gives many of the characters a bigger advantage because of the DMs. OH PLEASE. His opinion is he deosnt like Capcom games and the hes gonna do everything in his power to goto a Capcom based website and start shit for no reason other than to make his dick bigger, sound familiar? Yeah, it sounds like ImMature and Yojimbo, and your antics at Orochinagi.com, your point? Maybe if you wouldn't get so worked up about people not liking your favorite fighting game company these things wouldn't happen. The worst part about this is that you people wont even admit that SNK has made bad fighters, really really shitty fighters. Games like AOF(which deosnt even have a following in japan, you wont even be using that as an argument!), and the older FF are just plain not good, Why is AoF not good? I have yet to hear ANYONE tell me why AoF is not good other than the controls being bad and Ryo and Robert being Ken and Ryu rip offs (which was false to begin with). And you know what? WTF other games did you have to compare it to for controls? SF2? Nothing else. People didn't like AoF because it was a harder game, even though it had a ton of new stuff added to its gameplay. Fatal Fury 1 was just plain not good, why? I played it twice and got used to the controls, so what's the problem? What else was WRONG with it? Fatal Fury 2? I can do comboes in that just as well as I can in any other fighter of the time, so what was the problem? but becuase you happened to pay $300 for a cart you wont let it go that the game quite possibly could be terrible. Even i hate a few capcom fighters with a passion(SF3:3rd strike, Rival Schools, SFA, SFA3). I don't even own a Neo yet Ugh,i seriously dont like the trolling, im getting really tired of it. Rasa, i know why your here, Why am I here? you said yourself that you dont hate everything Capcom, but people who blatently dont like Capcom games like Krauser are here for 0 reason other than to piss Capcom's fans off??? So what? So what's your purpose on this board? Akumachan's? Mine? Dasrik's? ChunLi's, Javi's, Etc.? Everyone has a REASON to be here, trollers are a nessecary evil that will exist as long as we have freedom of speech. If you would just ignore them, you'd have no problems. Dont defend him, defend your games, but not him. I've been defending my games ever since someone told me Contra was shitting in 1989. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 04:38 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui Im really dont understand what your trying to say, but whatever. He's saying that he will continue to post like this as long as there are people like you giving him the time of day. Posted by Super_Donkey on 05:13:2001 04:48 AM: Ok I would like to share my input. First, SNK's first game obioviusly borrowed a ton from SF2, but the figthing system was differnt, and they had super combos. I'm talking about AOF 1, which to me is kinda lame, but I think it was very inovative. Kof94 seemed to play more like sf2 series than the Aof series, and for Fatal Furry 1, 2, 3, I think these games suck, But I do admit I like Real Bout 1, 2, 3. Personally if people say that 94,95,96 are the same their iditos... 94 had fix teams, 95 let you customize teams, and 96 completely changed the fighting system and a ton of the moves as well. But after 96, .e. 97,98,99 the game remained pretty much untouched. I think AOf3 has just as good animation as sf3 (not third strike). but sf3:third strike seems to be better than AOF3 Also in terms of gameplay, well I like Sf3:third better because of the parry system, about 80% of my game relies on parrying attacks, and I'm a natural born sf freak. I have played the shit out of g.m.o.t.w and I must says even the game is fast paced, it's not as deep and doesn't require as much stardegy as Sf3... Personnaly, I think SSF2 turbo is the best 2-d fighter, because I was the shit with bison back then... Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 04:55 AM: There is no Real Bout 3 Also, keep in mind that AoF was designed by the same person who did SF1. Hell Robert and Ryo+the AoF style was practically going to BE SF2, but Capcom didn't like it, so several employees left and went to SNK, where they finished up Fatal Fury and then did Art of Fighting (that's why it ended up not getting released until 1992). Also, I have to wonder, WAS a lot of stuff borrowed? I mean whenever two games are released around the same time it's not like one was released, then the other was able to copy everything and release their own version within the same week. Posted by ImMature on 05:13:2001 05:40 AM: SF3: 3S ==> The one and only Crapcom fighter that can compare to those of SNK *ever* However Garou: MOTW owns 3S for free! Posted by Akuma2002 on 05:13:2001 07:35 AM: Garou MOTW is cool. There arn`t a lot of snk games that i like but this one is awsome, it seems a little slow at times but it`s still pretty great.I still prefer sf3 3s though. Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 08:40 AM: "It's the staff members who designed KoF99 and 2K plus some of the original team (which had helped make Guilty Gear X with Arc Systems after they left)." Whoah wait, they left SNk to go work on Guilty Gear X, then came back to SNK? I also remember a good majority of KOF fans not liking KOF99 or 2K very much, how is this a good sign of things to come for KOF2001? Btw, SNK was sapposedly supervising the creation of CvS and we all know how that turned out. "Again, this is irrelevant and it's still just YOUR opinion about a game. I guess Mega Man 2 is a shit game because contests aren't still held for it? Or that Super Castlevania 4 is a shit game also because TG stopped excepting win times for it" Your right it is just my opinion. Megaman 2 and Castlevania are different stories there should be no comparison when it comes to a fighter which has infinite replay value. Explain why FF-FF2 still isnt played today? "The merchendise was made AFTER the Fatal Fury series became a hit. The Andy Bogard keychain in my pocket was made after Fatal Fury 3 came out, etc, the mangas were adapted from Takara's retelling of the plots in their SNES ports, etc. " UGH, you know i remember this movie called Water World a few years ago...It had a huge budget, was very much over hyped, there was merchindise out for it before it even came out(action figures), turns out the movie was terrible. But hey, FF was probably pretty popular, just like Tekken is, but in no way do i think its a good game(most KOF/SF fans will tell you its not for whatever reason). Merchindise means very little especially since Capcom sells more of it then damn near any game company in history. Does that say SF is more popular then KOF? You decide. "Power mode isn't good, that's why it IS good IMO, because you have to be good to win with it. It's the more technical of the two modes, but I think at the highest skill levels it gives many of the characters a bigger advantage because of the DMs." That statement doenst make a whole lot of sense. Just becuase you have to be good to win with a mode deosnt mean the mode is good, it means the player is good. The DM options you get in Power Mode like the SDM's and super cancels are WORTHLESS. Its very rare that anyone lands a SDM in LB2 to begin with considering that (A)90% of the supers in LB2 have a large amount of start up, you have to combo most of them to even land them, which is bad becuase (B)Landing a combo in power mode to begin with is damn near an impossibility unless your Setsuna becuase of the terrible start up on most power mode attacks(parry bait). The same goes for the super cancels, you have to land a hit first. More explaination as to why Speed mode owns power mode from me at neo-geo.com in the LB2 power/speed mode comparison thread in the gameplay forum from about a week ago. "Yeah, it sounds like ImMature and Yojimbo, and your antics at Orochinagi.com, your point? Maybe if you wouldn't get so worked up about people not liking your favorite fighting game company these things wouldn't happen. " Ive said it before and ill say it again there was no need for him to go off on Capcom AT ALL. This is a SF3 vs Garou thread right? Well he didnt just come in and say "SF3 sucks Garou is better", which i would have been fine with considering i hate SF3, but no, he had to be a dick about it and bash the entire company and its fans. You wonder why kids in middle school mow down there class mates with Uzi's, its these little unneeded comments that start it :P "Why is AoF not good? I have yet to hear ANYONE tell me why AoF is not good other than the controls being bad and Ryo and Robert being Ken and Ryu rip offs (which was false to begin with). And you know what? WTF other games did you have to compare it to for controls? SF2? Nothing else. People didn't like AoF because it was a harder game, even though it had a ton of new stuff added to its gameplay. Fatal Fury 1 was just plain not good, why? I played it twice and got used to the controls, so what's the problem? What else was WRONG with it? Fatal Fury 2? I can do comboes in that just as well as I can in any other fighter of the time, so what was the problem?" ACK, contol issues alone kill a fighter!!!!!!!! I dont care about Ryo vs Ryu rip off arguments, amateurs borrow, professionals steal, thats the way the world works. Other than control issues though the game had HORRID hit detection, very slow gameplay(which sometimes deosnt hurt a fighter but in combination with terrible controls...We have a loser), Most of the chrs even played in exactly the same way. Hell you could beat most players using retarded Zan Retsu Ken set ups(i use the term setup loosley when it comes to AOF), hell most of the other specials chrs had were useless to begin with. Not a good game. FF2 was playable, especially cuase i liked playing Jubei and doing cookie combos all day, but AOF was dirt. AOF 2 was slightly better but still pretty terrible even by the times standards, and AOF3 cleaned up the hit detection and added a strange combo system, but still wasnt a very good game. And despite what people think about the AMOUNT of frames used in AOF3, the game still looked really bad, the chrs looked incredibly stiff and the special attack animations(Something SNK is the best at yet...)were just really bad looking. "I don't even own a Neo yet " Why do i have a hard time believing that? You must have a friend that owns one or you know of an arcade that actually still has SNK games in the US other than KOF. "I've been defending my games ever since someone told me Contra was shitting in 1989. " I didnt think it was possible for a game to shit Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 08:43 AM: You would know ofcourse bieng a big SF player right? :P quote: Originally posted by ImMature SF3: 3S ==> The one and only Crapcom fighter that can compare to those of SNK *ever* However Garou: MOTW owns 3S for free! Posted by CykoClops on 05:13:2001 10:06 AM: i reckon 3rd strike is better, the animation is just heaps better... and it's got heaps more characters Posted by EndLeSS8 on 05:13:2001 10:24 AM: I dunno. Personally, I can't play MOTW worth crap. That doesn't mean I don't like it...it's just that I like 3S better. As bad as this may sound, I find 3S more fun than MOTW. IMO (I talked to Dog aboot this already). MOTW's Just Defence system is flawed. There's no (okay, very little) risk involved with Just Defence. Just Defend too early, and you block. No pain involved. But in 3S, you parry wrong, yer screwed. But MOTW's guard crush system is good. BTW, NO WAY IN HELL Fatal Fury 2 sucks! FF2 ROCKED! That game was a DAMN good sequel, and a damn good game in general. The controls were tweaked and the moves were queaked better. Again, this is another "non-arguement" arguement. Kamui, no offense, but you seem to really like these. At least we (ImMature, Rasa, me, etc) have fun with these topics, but you go apeshit with these topics. Calm down man. You've got hometown advantage already Don't pop a vein or something! l8z Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:13:2001 11:18 AM: I dont like sf3, the gameplay is very easy and the graphics are killer, but thats not what im looking for. First one of my fav neo games is AOF 2. Some may say "but that game is too hard", I like games that are next to freaking impossible, and nothing capcom has released in the fighting dept. Has been a challenge to me, first Kamui I am not here to start trouble im here to voice and opinion on games ive been playing for years, and no, I wont spend 300 on a game that is total crap. You dont know who I am you obviously jump to conclusions, which is natural. If you knew me in the slightest you would think differently. Me and NeoRasa kick it in chat every couple of days or so, im cool with him. I dont hate anyone, nobody is worthy of that title at least not yet. You must see it this way (if you will) its the internet, if you knew me in real life you would find im a hardcore neo fan, anyone can assume I am collector, but where is the proof for the assumption? I tell it like it is, if people hate that oh well. I may appear biased but im not. I HATE STREET FIGHTER, I have been a fighting game fan for years. A one sided view at best and shows you cant see between the lines. You would not believe how good I am at Capcom fighters and such, you think im some person that knows jack shit about capcom to begin with, I have been buying capcom games for years! Thats right even the first megaman with the ugliest cover art ever issued. One thing people dont do is question my fandom. I AM HARDCORE, you may sit there and think "this guy hasnt a clue" but you dont and never will know anything about me if you brush me off as some no brainer person that doesnt know. Few can don the title SNK DEVIL. My best character in SF3 is Remy, I can clean house with him. I am damn good at fighters and believe that a hyper viper beam is flash and no skill, look at KOF for example you cant mash your way to victory like in Mvs series. How easy are infinities to do??? A cinch! If you ever have lost to a button masher, you deserved to be mocked. I am a mean person, I have proved beyond a reasonable doubt that when I joined ON.COM, but if you read some of the threads I responded to, you would see that I have more knowledge then meets the eye. You kamui can tell all the people in the world that I am a collector but I am a gamer first and allways will be. Shawn Mclesky at NG.com is the worlds greatest Shigen player in last blade 2. How do people brand him??? As a greedy cart collector and nothing more. Just because I can afford a 300 dollar game I deserve some credit, do you know anyone crazy enough to spend that much on any game?? I spent 369 on my kof 2000 the day it released (was going to get the mvs but 1600 was to much for my budget at the time)and I dont regret a single penny spent. I could care less about what people say about the active striker system ruining the games overall feel. You Kamui are nothing but a force blamer, blatantly talking trash about people you havent a clue about. This is expectable from a child at least I hope you fit the descriptive attitude you are putting forward. Capcom is a racist franchise to begin with, I HATE THERE DAMN STEREOTYPES! I like SNK more because they have "fan dedication" A rare find these days. SNK listens to its fans and does'nt make product to get teenagers attention (another obvious stereotype ridden by the simple minded). I am also disgusted by the way they have a view of other races and cultures. As someone said "the characters are very easy to recognize" this is very true. If capcom could ease on the stereotypes a bit I would be more enviting to there style but when they release games that are no skill then I will look on... I am a SNK fan, look at ryu, he is so typical a character with a headband and a GI, now look at terry no headband no stereotype, which shows SNK staff realises that characters arent all meant to be what history prevades. Lets also look at Iori, hes very different, and very original. Lets look at Gouki/Akuma he is another typical character, I still think Remy is a damn fresh idea, only if capcom could create more and not over wash there product every year with a simple upgrade. There plan works this way, they spawn a really high number of sequals until the fans crave a new product ala sf4 when the new product releases then they do it over and over, history repeats my friends, and knowledge should heighthen a little after you see this a hundread times over, at least I hope...... Posted by PrOzErG on 05:13:2001 12:12 PM: quote: Originally posted by EndLeSS8 I dunno. Personally, I can't play MOTW worth crap. That doesn't mean I don't like it...it's just that I like 3S better. As bad as this may sound, I find 3S more fun than MOTW. IMO (I talked to Dog aboot this already). MOTW's Just Defence system is flawed. There's no (okay, very little) risk involved with Just Defence. Just Defend too early, and you block. No pain involved. But in 3S, you parry wrong, yer screwed. But MOTW's guard crush system is good. BTW, NO WAY IN HELL Fatal Fury 2 sucks! FF2 ROCKED! That game was a DAMN good sequel, and a damn good game in general. The controls were tweaked and the moves were queaked better. Again, this is another "non-arguement" arguement. Kamui, no offense, but you seem to really like these. At least we (ImMature, Rasa, me, etc) have fun with these topics, but you go apeshit with these topics. Calm down man. You've got hometown advantage already Don't pop a vein or something! l8z ENDLESS !!!!!!! You are here ?? Why have you left neo-geo.com ??? Posted by BillyKane on 05:13:2001 02:00 PM: I like them both equally. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 04:34 PM: Whoah wait, they left SNk to go work on Guilty Gear X, then came back to SNK? Yes. Talent swapping happens every month between all of these game companies. I also remember a good majority of KOF fans not liking KOF99 or 2K very much, how is this a good sign of things to come for KOF2001? Btw, SNK was sapposedly supervising the creation of CvS and we all know how that turned out. The majority of KoF fans took a liking to KoF'99 and '00 now that it's been out for a while and they have been able to get used to its system, etc. Your right it is just my opinion. Megaman 2 and Castlevania are different stories there should be no comparison when it comes to a fighter which has infinite replay value. That's bullshit, if fighters had infinite replay value then we'd still be playing Yie Air Kung Fu. Explain why FF-FF2 still isnt played today? I can't explain that because I was playing FF2 today. UGH, you know i remember this movie called Water World a few years ago...It had a huge budget, was very much over hyped, there was merchindise out for it before it even came out(action figures), turns out the movie was terrible. This has absolutely nothing to do with ANYTHING. The Fatal Fury merchendise was not released until after the games became hits, remember? "The merchendise was made AFTER the Fatal Fury series became a hit. The Andy Bogard keychain in my pocket was made after Fatal Fury 3 came out, etc, the mangas were adapted from Takara's retelling of the plots in their SNES ports, etc. " ~Neo Rasa This was the paragraph you quoted just before in case you missed it. But hey, FF was probably pretty popular,...blah blah blah blah blah blah... Yeah, the series has been alive for eleven years, most television shows don't last that long, hell most film franchises don't last that long, so yes, I'd say it's pretty popular. Capcom sells more of it then damn near any game company in history. Does that say SF is more popular then KOF? You decide. Don't take what I've said out of context. My point is that the merchendise wouldn't have been made afterwards if the series was not popular. That statement doenst make a whole lot of sense. Just becuase you have to be good to win with a mode deosnt mean the mode is good, it means the player is good. Why does that not make sense? I thought the concept of the fighting game was to defeat the CPU/player that you're fighting against. If you're able to do it with a handicap in the other players favor, meaning you're a far superior player to the opponent, then yes, Power Mode is good if it gives you that oppurtunity. The DM options you get in Power Mode like the SDM's and super cancels are WORTHLESS. Its very rare that anyone lands a SDM in LB2 to begin with considering that (A)90% of the supers in LB2 have a large amount of start up, you have to combo most of them to even land them, which is bad becuase (B)Landing a combo in power mode to begin with is damn near an impossibility unless your Setsuna becuase of the terrible start up on most power mode attacks(parry bait). The same goes for the super cancels, you have to land a hit first. Boo hoo this mode sucks because I can't do a combo in it. More explaination as to why Speed mode owns power mode from me at neo-geo.com in the LB2 power/speed mode comparison thread in the gameplay forum from about a week ago. I have to do outside research just to discuss something with you? Fuck that . If you don't want to at least cut paste your reasons here then why did you even bring up Last Blade 2 in the first place? Ive said it before and ill say it again there was no need for him to go off on Capcom AT ALL. This is a SF3 vs Garou thread right? Well he didnt just come in and say "SF3 sucks Garou is better", which i would have been fine with considering i hate SF3, but no, he had to be a dick about it and bash the entire company and its fans. You wonder why kids in middle school mow down there class mates with Uzi's, its these little unneeded comments that start it You're right, Yojimbo is the only person on SRK.com that ever talks shit or acts like a dick. Why does Yojimbo in particular bother you so much? ACK, contol issues alone kill a fighter!!!!!!!! COMPARED TO WHAT?!?! This is what I mean. Yie Air Kung Fu, Street Smart, and Karate Champ don't have special moves and Street Fighter 1 had pitiful hit detection, so the only competition AoF1 had was Fatal Fury, Fatal Fury 2, and Street Fighter 2. Who was to say what good control was at the time? Most people were turned off from it just because it was harder to play. the game had HORRID hit detection, ...? Explain. very slow gameplay(which sometimes deosnt hurt a fighter but in combination with terrible controls...We have a loser), Was the gameplay really that slow? Again what other games could you compare it to? The game traded speed for graphical and audio flare, while introducing many new gameplay techniques at the same time, THAT'S why I like the game. Most of the chrs even played in exactly the same way. Ryo and Robert played alike. King and John Crawley shared ONE special move. That's it. Hell you could beat most players using retarded Zan Retsu Ken set ups(i use the term setup loosley when it comes to AOF), Why use the term set up loosely? O_o; hell most of the other specials chrs had were useless to begin with. Please, Kasanete had awesome vertical range, Tornado Kick rocked, Burning Upper and Rolling Upper could stuff a lot of the other characters' projectiles, Gen ei Ken was a great punishment move, Hien Shippu Kyaku was great to use against turtlers, etc. But again, special moves weren't the emphasis of the game. Why do you think A+C and B+C hard attacks were included, the ability to do more than one attack in mid air, etc.? Not a good game. FF2 was playable, especially cuase i liked playing Jubei and doing cookie combos all day, but AOF was dirt. Opinion. AOF 2 was slightly better but still pretty terrible even by the times standards, Is that a joke? AoF2's sound and graphics blew away almost any other fighter on the market at the time. The speed was much faster, the controls were improved, four new characters were added plus a hidden battle with a special ending, etc. At the time this was the one fighter that made even the most die-hard and biased Street Fighter 2 fans take their blinders off and try something different. Did you not like it because the throw escapes and projectile parrying were too much for you to handle at the time? and AOF3 cleaned up the hit detection and added a strange combo system, but still wasnt a very good game. Also, AoF3 would NOT have been made if the previous AoFs were not popular. And despite what people think about the AMOUNT of frames used in AOF3, the game still looked really bad, Bullshit. The sprites and backgrounds clicked together almost perfectly in this game IMO. Even the most stalwart haters of AoF3 will admit that it looks beautiful. the chrs looked incredibly stiff and the special attack animations(Something SNK is the best at yet...)were just really bad looking. You're partially correct here, it was a mistake on SNK's part to use motion capture data for the sprites in this installment because videogame style martial arts are more exciting to look at than real life martial art stances. Oh well. Honestly though, Robert Garcia? He's practically dancing in his fighting stance, do you really consider his animations stiff? I found a lot more life in AoF3s characters than I did in the first SF3... Why do i have a hard time believing that? I have no idea. Do you not trust me? Is your innate desire to argue and one-up people at the point where you have to disbelieve EVERYTHING I say? Do you think I'd bother to make up something I'm going to post on a single board that has no effect on my life outside of when I'm posting on it? Do you have an ingrained disliking of me because I like SNK style fighters more than Capcom ones? You must have a friend that owns one or you know of an arcade that actually still has SNK games in the US other than KOF. Living and hour and a half from Chinatown does help. I didnt think it was possible for a game to shit Play Conker's Bad Fur Day. Posted by Bastion on 05:13:2001 07:13 PM: quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser I dont like sf3, the gameplay is very easy and the graphics are killer, but thats not what im looking for. First one of my fav neo games is AOF 2. Some may say "but that game is too hard", I like games that are next to freaking impossible, and nothing capcom has released in the fighting dept. Has been a challenge to me, first Kamui I am not here to start trouble im here to voice and opinion on games ive been playing for years, and no, I wont spend 300 on a game that is total crap. You dont know who I am you obviously jump to conclusions, which is natural. If you knew me in the slightest you would think differently. Me and NeoRasa kick it in chat every couple of days or so, im cool with him. I dont hate anyone, nobody is worthy of that title at least not yet. You must see it this way (if you will) its the internet, if you knew me in real life you would find im a hardcore neo fan, anyone can assume I am collector, but where is the proof for the assumption? I tell it like it is, if people hate that oh well. I may appear biased but im not. I HATE STREET FIGHTER, I have been a fighting game fan for years. A one sided view at best and shows you cant see between the lines. You would not believe how good I am at Capcom fighters and such, you think im some person that knows jack shit about capcom to begin with, I have been buying capcom games for years! Thats right even the first megaman with the ugliest cover art ever issued. One thing people dont do is question my fandom. I AM HARDCORE, you may sit there and think "this guy hasnt a clue" but you dont and never will know anything about me if you brush me off as some no brainer person that doesnt know. Few can don the title SNK DEVIL. My best character in SF3 is Remy, I can clean house with him. I am damn good at fighters and believe that a hyper viper beam is flash and no skill, look at KOF for example you cant mash your way to victory like in Mvs series. How easy are infinities to do??? A cinch! If you ever have lost to a button masher, you deserved to be mocked. I am a mean person, I have proved beyond a reasonable doubt that when I joined ON.COM, but if you read some of the threads I responded to, you would see that I have more knowledge then meets the eye. You kamui can tell all the people in the world that I am a collector but I am a gamer first and allways will be. Shawn Mclesky at NG.com is the worlds greatest Shigen player in last blade 2. How do people brand him??? As a greedy cart collector and nothing more. Just because I can afford a 300 dollar game I deserve some credit, do you know anyone crazy enough to spend that much on any game?? I spent 369 on my kof 2000 the day it released (was going to get the mvs but 1600 was to much for my budget at the time)and I dont regret a single penny spent. I could care less about what people say about the active striker system ruining the games overall feel. You Kamui are nothing but a force blamer, blatantly talking trash about people you havent a clue about. This is expectable from a child at least I hope you fit the descriptive attitude you are putting forward. Capcom is a racist franchise to begin with, I HATE THERE DAMN STEREOTYPES! I like SNK more because they have "fan dedication" A rare find these days. SNK listens to its fans and does'nt make product to get teenagers attention (another obvious stereotype ridden by the simple minded). I am also disgusted by the way they have a view of other races and cultures. As someone said "the characters are very easy to recognize" this is very true. If capcom could ease on the stereotypes a bit I would be more enviting to there style but when they release games that are no skill then I will look on... I am a SNK fan, look at ryu, he is so typical a character with a headband and a GI, now look at terry no headband no stereotype, which shows SNK staff realises that characters arent all meant to be what history prevades. Lets also look at Iori, hes very different, and very original. Lets look at Gouki/Akuma he is another typical character, I still think Remy is a damn fresh idea, only if capcom could create more and not over wash there product every year with a simple upgrade. There plan works this way, they spawn a really high number of sequals until the fans crave a new product ala sf4 when the new product releases then they do it over and over, history repeats my friends, and knowledge should heighthen a little after you see this a hundread times over, at least I hope..... I didn't want to get in the middle of this but, you contradicted yourself. NO! SNK NEVER stereotypes anyone. Proof the above statement isn't true Second, Terry IS a sterotype of an American. Blonde hair, blue jeans, sports jacket, ball cap. Reminds me of a American Stereotype. Ryu is a student of martial arts, so he wears what a student of martial arts wears. It wouldn't make sense to have him in leather pants with a strap linked to each leg, casue Ryu is a student of martial arts! If that makes him a stereotype then FINE. But so is every other person in the world that wears a Gi and a headband. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 07:22 PM: Bastion: Don't take WolfgangKrauser seriously, I think I already mentioned that he's just a random sociopath who has way too much money to spend. Posted by DarthSalamander on 05:13:2001 08:13 PM: quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa Don't take WolfgangKrauser seriously I don't think any one really is or even could . Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:13:2001 08:16 PM: Seriously, you'd think my brother would be the laughing stock of the world since it's public knowledge that Terry Bogard imprinted his fist on his chest and he got so ashamed that he faked his own death. He even let me use him as an exscuse to enter the King of Fighters tournament in 1996 so I could check out this Orochi 'power' everyone was talking about. It wasn't anything worth writing home about though, so after that I just had my right hand man Billy take my KoF invitations again as usual with his own team. Posted by DarthSalamander on 05:13:2001 09:22 PM: quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa Seriously, you'd think my brother would be the laughing stock of the world since it's public knowledge that Terry Bogard imprinted his fist on his chest and he got so ashamed that he faked his own death. He even let me use him as an exscuse to enter the King of Fighters tournament in 1996 so I could check out this Orochi 'power' everyone was talking about. It wasn't anything worth writing home about though, so after that I just had my right hand man Billy take my KoF invitations again as usual with his own team. errrr ok Neo Ra... I mean Geese Howard. Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 09:35 PM: "Again, this is another "non-arguement" arguement. Kamui, no offense, but you seem to really like these. At least we (ImMature, Rasa, me, etc) have fun with these topics, but you go apeshit with these topics. Calm down man. You've got hometown advantage already Don't pop a vein or something!" Gggrr...Im sorry but I didnt start this argument. You know i think its expected that when someone bashes An entire company in a thread labeled "Garou vs SF3" that i throw a fit. I usually do, why are people suprised? :P Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 09:49 PM: "You would not believe how good I am at Capcom fighters and such, you think im some person that knows jack shit about capcom to begin with, I have been buying capcom games for years!" Oh really? We will see... "My best character in SF3 is Remy, I can clean house with him." Oooppss...We have a winner. Sorry man, its damn near impossible to clean house with Remy, the competition for SF3 where you are must SUCK bad. Remy isnt a good chr, this is a fact. He has no realistic way of winning. Just more proof that you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to Capcom games. If you want to argue with me about SF3 and why Remy isnt good please do, but im telling you right now you wont win. "I am damn good at fighters and believe that a hyper viper beam is flash and no skill, look at KOF for example you cant mash your way to victory like in Mvs series. How easy are infinities to do??? A cinch!" You have absolutely no idea what your talking about, i would like to see you mash your way to victory against Darth Slamander or any other person on this board who actually plays MvC2. Ouch, to bad i may never know how good you really are. Hey wait, are you going to the SNK tourney in Texas? I hope so... "Shawn Mclesky at NG.com is the worlds greatest Shigen player in last blade 2." LOL, and how did he get this label may i ask? Im sure he traveled around the world just to play against the best right? LOL. Ok ok, you must be joking around now, i mean no one smokes crack while posting on a forum. "You Kamui are nothing but a force blamer, blatantly talking trash about people you havent a clue about. This is expectable from a child at least I hope you fit the descriptive attitude you are putting forward." LOL, this is comming from someone who just labeled himself damn good at fighters when he plays Remy in 3s and claims he cleans house with him!?!?!? LOL Not to mention the fact that your spending your free time on a forum trying to start crap with people. Your the one blatantly talking trash about games you know NOTHING ABOUT!!!!! Period. "Capcom is a racist franchise to begin with, I HATE THERE DAMN STEREOTYPES!" Racist?!?!?! How so!?!?! You have made up so much BS in your head about a freakin company for crying out loud that your actually believing it!!! People always have to find something to hate, whether its BS or not. Posted by DarthSalamander on 05:13:2001 10:19 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui You have absolutely no idea what your talking about, i would like to see you mash your way to victory against Darth Slamander or any other person on this board who actually plays MvC2. Who is Darth Slamander? Is Wolfgang supposed to be going to the SNK tourney? When/where is it any way? I will dominate with Panda striker in 2000. Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 10:42 PM: SHIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!! I just replied to your post Rasa and it got an error saying there were to many images on it or something, i hit the back button and what do you know, the post is gone. However, this is what i posted about Power mode vs Speed mode on neo-geo.com: "People should know that power mode becomes all but useless in later play, even for Setsuna, who is arguably the best chr for Power Mode (next to Shigen)Power Mode automatically loses to speed mode for free, too the extent where if they just block one of your attacks they can land a free combo on you becuase the recovery on Power mode attacks is so bad(even most light attacks), no need to even parry. You also lose chains, which have a lot more uses other than just cool looking combos. If you start a chain theres a long enough period of time from begining to end to see if its blocked or not, if its blocked you end it with a special attack that will leave you safe even if they block it, or you can just stop the chain midway if you expect a mid chain parry. If it hits continue with your most damaging combo. Despite parries bieng somewhat of a threat to speed mode becuase of the easy to see multiple hits, it deosnt matter, your going to be waiting for them to attack first, then counter on there recovery. IF your going to play power mode though, i suggest you use Setsuna. He is IMO the best power chr in the game. His Jump HS after a Hop just covers a massive amount of area, and becuase it hits twice its out on the way up from your jump AND on the way down. He basically gets to jump for free, with little worry of retaliation(if they parry, which will happen a lot, the amount of damage they can do to you is limited becuase your airborn). This is your best set up for doing damage as you dont need to worry about timing the jump in and you cant rely on your ground attacks as much. He also has multi hit HS's, though not as fast as speed mode chains, he still his has long 2 hit attacks, which are useful for what mentioned above about having more time to actually see whether or not that attack hits and canceling it into a safer move if blocked. Power mode Setsuna is also something to fear when he hits red(though most people dont stay in red for long), he gains the ability to use his lightning "Charge" super, which has the ability to nail people while there on the ground for good damage, and you gain his "charge" properties, which btw if he lands a Toward + C on you while your in the corner with a charge, your dead, period, he can juggle you for a max of 75% damage easy." About AOF's hit detection, pick King vs King, have one start dashing into the other King then have the ooposing King do a tornado kick, the will randomly phase through each other. Youll also notice that randomly for some reason you will appear on the other side of you opponent after a jump in when its clearly not a cross up(which dont really exist in AOF anyways, or atleast not to a usefull extent). There was even a site that listed these wierd hit detection happenings, but its long dead by now i assume. BYE BYE!!!! Posted by Kamui on 05:13:2001 10:43 PM: No idea if hes going, but its in Dallas in June 16th. PANDA SUX!!!!!!! > quote: Originally posted by DarthSalamander Who is Darth Slamander? Is Wolfgang supposed to be going to the SNK tourney? When/where is it any way? I will dominate with Panda striker in 2000. Posted by Burning Rose on 05:13:2001 10:43 PM: MOTW i love dat game but ssf3 better Posted by JBNagis on 05:13:2001 11:01 PM: I like them both,BUT i like the character design of Garou more than SF3rd.Freeman,Griffin,Marco,Gato are nice designs that arent the same stuff you see.i guess i am just tired of black boxers,and Shoto's.i don't hate them at all,i just want somethin alittle different. And both companies have ripped from each other.everyone knows Garou is SNk's answer to SF3rd.but whats wrong with that.nothin,if it gets us another good game.keep the answers coming if you ask me. I have little hope for the recent fighters coming out.CvS2,KoF2k1.both of those games sound like they will be nowere near as good as they should be.and yes IMO CvS1 is WEAK! but thats just me. Posted by Shock Mega X on 05:13:2001 11:02 PM: Hey Kamui, are you actually trying to imply that Fatal Fury Special isn't good? It's got better gameplay than the original SF2 for damn sure, also 15 characters, supers, etc. Maybe Super Turbo beats it, but that's it. And AOF2 is great, you can actually pick everybody in one-plywer mode this time, and the story and scaling graphics were great. Why hasn't Capcom done this yet? Posted by SHUNxGOKUxSATSU on 05:13:2001 11:09 PM: which do i think is better? snk or capcom? snk does have a bit more creativity than capcom (how many more shoto's will they come up with!?) but snk did continue names like capcom (a kof for every f**cken year!!!), and i liked the story line of Kyo and Iori better than Ryu or Ken (atleast kyo and iori look different other than just their head and suit/skin colour) but if your like me, and you just go for the game play, CAPCOM ALWAYS WINS in that part which is why i would say Street Fighter 3 owns Garou just as much as CAPCOM OWNS SNK!!!! Posted by Akuma2002 on 05:14:2001 12:42 AM: Why do people keep saying oh 3s owns garou and vice versa and capcom owns snk and vice versa? Give it a freakin rest allready! capcom fans are allways gonna say there games are better and snk fans are allways gonna there games are better. Thats the way it`s allways gonna be there`s no point to arguing about it. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 12:52 AM: Kamui: That happened to me the first time I replied to you. Anyways I still like using Power mode for the extra challenge, and I can actually be pretty affective with Moriya and Yuki while using it (Yuki especially). You should give it a chance! Posted by SHUNxGOKUxSATSU on 05:14:2001 12:55 AM: quote: Originally posted by Akuma2002 Why do people keep saying oh 3s owns garou and vice versa and capcom owns snk and vice versa? Give it a freakin rest allready! capcom fans are allways gonna say there games are better and snk fans are allways gonna there games are better. Thats the way it`s allways gonna be there`s no point to arguing about it. i agree Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 02:14 AM: Well Yuki is probably one of the worsed chrs in the game IMO, she really isnt any better in Power or speed mode. If you like Power mode you must play Setsuna or Shigen. Power mode Setsuna is very much playable and very fun in Power mode. If your for a challenge play un-awakened Kaede, hesw really fun to play and very hard to win with. quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa Kamui: That happened to me the first time I replied to you. Anyways I still like using Power mode for the extra challenge, and I can actually be pretty affective with Moriya and Yuki while using it (Yuki especially). You should give it a chance! Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 02:16 AM: No i dont think tis very good, i think it was pretty good for its time, but Fatal Fury specials equal super turbo is a much better game IMO. quote: Originally posted by Shock Mega X Hey Kamui, are you actually trying to imply that Fatal Fury Special isn't good? It's got better gameplay than the original SF2 for damn sure, also 15 characters, supers, etc. Maybe Super Turbo beats it, but that's it. And AOF2 is great, you can actually pick everybody in one-plywer mode this time, and the story and scaling graphics were great. Why hasn't Capcom done this yet? Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 02:16 AM: I MUST play as Shigen or Setsuna? I'll play as whoever the hell I want! :p Musashi in Power mode >:)~~~~~~~` Posted by Lord Doom on 05:14:2001 02:24 AM: I personally like both of the games. I think that I do like SF3 over Garou by a slight edge though. Posted by WolfgangKrauser on 05:14:2001 03:55 AM: quote: Originally posted by Bastion I didn't want to get in the middle of this but, you contradicted yourself. NO! SNK NEVER stereotypes anyone. Proof the above statement isn't true Second, Terry IS a sterotype of an American. Blonde hair, blue jeans, sports jacket, ball cap. Reminds me of a American Stereotype. Ryu is a student of martial arts, so he wears what a student of martial arts wears. It wouldn't make sense to have him in leather pants with a strap linked to each leg, casue Ryu is a student of martial arts! If that makes him a stereotype then FINE. But so is every other person in the world that wears a Gi and a headband. I understand what you mean, but Capcom characters are almost all stereotypes look at Gill, he portrays a god, no doubt thats the way they view greeks. I did not contradict myself. I made a good point in regards to the handling of there company, they use the younger audience as pawns, which is legal if there going to side with a no brainer company. Have you played last blade 1 and 2 before? These games are almost completely original and the stereotypes such as Akatsuki Musashi are there derived from history but not at and extreme extent. Now look at ryu at first he was not a stereotype, then there is Gouki, Ken, Dan, Sean, is there not a point where capcom can draw the line, originality is impossible to find. SNK made ALOT of sequels but capcom made almost twice to three times in there position, which begs the question how many do we need? Bottom line, SNK tries new formulas for its fans, capcom is pure profit. Cool charact ers get butchered when they never change. "It wouldn't make sense to have him in leather pants with a strap linked to each leg" This is what makes Iori cool, he is like no other. My ideas towards capcom may appear to be biased, but I have written reviews on some SNK games I was disgusted with. Spinmaster (data-east neo title) being of of them. I also disliked fatal fury 3, which took a turning point in the series, after special SNK counted to three! Posted by Bastion on 05:14:2001 05:36 AM: I should have found a better word then contradict...your right. But I felt you were playing SNK up as if they were the extreme opposite of Capcom when it comes to stereotyping, when they are both in the gray. quote: Capcom characters are almost all stereotypes look at Gill, he portrays a god, no doubt thats the way they view greeks. Have you played last blade 1 and 2 before? These games are almost completely original and the stereotypes such as Akatsuki Musashi are there derived from history but not at and extreme extent. Now look at ryu at first he was not a stereotype, then there is Gouki, Ken, Dan, Sean, is there not a point where capcom can draw the line, originality is impossible to find. I completely disagree that the majority of Capcom characters are stereotypes. You are right Capcom does use some stereotypes Guile and the Shoto. They are oversimplified characteristics of a type of fighter. The army style gets the army clothes, the Shoto Karate style gets the Gi. But now thinking about it...I don't beleive that stereotyping is the problem that should concern either of us. SNK does it, and so does Capcom. But that is a device to let the players bond with the characters, and not really a proof of lazzy developer's oversimplification. The Street Fighter 2 exception. Good God this games characters were simple. Karate characters get Gi India monk gets tatterd clothing American Army guy gets blonde hair, blue eyes, a tank top US boxer is black...originally named Mike Bison. Wrestler is big, and wears wrestling underwear as far as I see the only non stereotyped characters are Blanka, M.Bison, and Sagat(Sagat is borderline). But if I was trying to introduce a new type of game genre to a crowd of kids in the 8-13 range then I'd want to give them a selection af characters that can be summed up in a glance. I bet there are kids that played as Guile cause he was in the Army...so he had to be stronger (in fact I remember my babysitters kid saying that). If they put Guile in blue Jeans and a leather jacket, it's not visibly clear he is in the army. Post Street Fighter 2 Capcom Since then things have gotten alot better. Alpha brought use *Guy, Adon, Rose, Sodom, Charlie, Birdie. And Alpha 2 brought Sakura, Rolento, Gen. Alpha 3 gave us Karin, R.Mika, and Cody. All of them are original, hardly stereotypical...cept maybe Cody (I like his stripes more than a solid orange jumpsuit though). SF3 had Necro (please give me a reason why he is stereotyping!), Hugo, Makoto, Q, Alex, Dudley, Elena, Remy, Twelve. The above was just Street Fighter...I'm just getting started. The vampire series was completely unique. It functioned ON stereotypes! But it did so through creativity. It was important for people to realize they just selected a Zombie just from looking at the character sprite, but they created Lord Raptor (Zabel) in a way that they re-created the zombie image. Zabel doesn't look like any Zombie I've ever been introduced to through other media (like tv). Sasquatch doesn't look like the image seen in blurry video, he looks cute and hugable. So it's hard to say, did Capcom throw together a bunch of monster stereotypes? Yes. Did they create new images for these stereotyped...Vampire gets a cape...monsters? Yes. They weren't lacking any creativity when they made this game. They CERTAINLY get a A+++ for some characters like Jedah, Q-Bee, Bulletta, and Hsien Ko. The Rival Schools series...Fuck! To hear people bash Capcom because they are uncreative?!?!? This series is the ANSWER to there whinning. There are a few again... that are based on stereotypes, like any of the sports characters (I wonder why? Not like high schools are filled with stereotypes ) But a GOOD majority are original. No need to get into them. Cyberbots, Star Gladiator...some other minor fighting games that never took off. They had near zero steretypes and look what happened to them....heh. The Shoto Explanation The looooooooooong running arguement from SNK fanboys is that Capcom....sorry...cRapcom has redone Ryu's sprite 40 times and that they are a company full of uncreative monkeys looking for nothing but profit. Yaaa....um. The first Street Fighter went like this. If you play as P1 then you have a white Gi, if you play as P2 you have a Red Gi. That's it. When they went to SF2 they kept the traditon alive. Ken and Ryu look the same, they do have a few different animations. But they are VERY different gameplay wise. Gouki was a secret character, just someone they threw togeter at the last minute. He doesn't even have a Character portrait in SSF2X. Sean's standing animation is the same, but thats it. Everything else is different about him. I have played each Last Blade, Sam Sho is probally one of the coolest games aswell cause they used the same approach...using history. Kinda the same situation as the Vampire series. Gill is Greek? Huh, guess I never knew that cause I never got to Gill before. I hoped that made you think a bit, and prompts a response, the arguement of what is a stereotype is so fuzzy to begin with. It's fun debating the difference between creating a stereotype, and creating a completely new (and out of place) character. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 06:03 AM: I always felt they did the best job with the Vampire/Darkstalkers series myself. Alpha brought use *Guy, Adon, Rose, Sodom, Charlie, Birdie. I don't know though. I mean honestly, you and I both know that Adon and Birdie are from SF1 and Guy+Sodom are from Final Fight. Rose was actually GOING to be a Darkstalkers character but she was thrown into Alpha kind of at the last second. She ended up being my favorite Alpha character though. Anyways, I bring up the SF1 characters because they were in SF1, and I bring up the Final Fight characters because Final Fight, like Darkstalkers, is another game that FUNCTIONED on stereotypes. When I still lived in Brooklyn (and was extremely young) I used to swear that all the characters in Final Fight were based on actual people I had scene. Yes, there was a guy in a wheelchair with a handlebar 'stache lik Belgar! I never knew what to make of Charlie, I mean he broke from the stereotype for sure, but was he a good design? It's in the eye of the beholder I guess O_o; And Alpha 2 brought Sakura, Rolento, Gen. Rolento's another Final Fight character, and Gen's another SF1 guy Alpha 3 gave us Karin, R.Mika, and Cody. All of them are original, hardly stereotypical...cept maybe Cody (I like his stripes more than a solid orange jumpsuit though). Karin was actually 'borrowed' from an independant SF manga that was popular at the time, as were a lot of the EX characters. I THINK R. Mika was as well but I'm not sure. I wasn't too crazy about Cody's remake, he was one guy I was hoping would STAY in his stereotype . SF3 had Necro (please give me a reason why he is stereotyping!), He...uh...is the Russian...uh...necromantic...stretchy......uhm......YEAH THAT'S RIGHT BITCH! Hugo, This is the only one where I honestly do disagree, because Hugo was and is a SHAMELESS André the Giant takeoff, just as much as Axel Hawk was a Butterbean ripoff and Balrog was a Mike Tyson one. Cyberbots, Star Gladiator...some other minor fighting games that never took off. They had near zero steretypes and look what happened to them....heh. That's why the stereotypes are unfortunately nessecary in most games, I mean Kizuna Encounter was a GREAT game and 90% of the people on this board have never even heard of it, much less actually played it, all because it had a new cast and look. Gill is Greek? Huh, guess I never knew that cause I never got to Gill before. Yeah, strange. Did you know that Krizalid from The King of Fighters '99 is Irish? O_o; He's the, uh, cyborg, flame thrower, tornado kick stereotype *lol* Posted by JBNagis on 05:14:2001 08:36 AM: Axel Hawk was a Goerge Forman ripp not a butterbean rip.allthough both could be true. Bison/Vega is the chinese Officer sterotype.Watch a Anime called Doomed Megalopolise.the main bad guy is dressed in a chinese officer uniform.just like Bison/Vega's. Q is OG.Necro is Dhalsim and blankas love child >_< Makato reminds me of Takuma alittle bit.dont' ask me why,just when i see Makato,i think of Takuma.AND I SWEAR Makato design reminds me of SNK work.Capcom rarely takes ideas from anime's for there street fighters.and Makato is Tendo Akane.and SNK gets idea's from everywere. from history (Hanzo Hattori),Card Games (Genjuro),Kung Fu Movies (Lee Rekka,Chin Gentsai).it maybe just me.but Makato feels more SNK than Capcom.but thats just my OP. Posted by EndLeSS8 on 05:14:2001 09:21 AM: quote: Originally posted by PrOzErG ENDLESS !!!!!!! You are here ?? Why have you left neo-geo.com ??? Yea! It's me... I got sick and tired of all that crap with the Devils, and Fran, and all that. It just didn't "flow" right. At least here, I can have some decent conversation, and most of the ppl I know are here. Seeya around! (BTW, nice first post! LOL!) l8z Posted by Muskau on 05:14:2001 10:16 AM: Wern't we supposed to be arguing about SF3 and MOTW? All's I see are people talking about Final Fight and AOF! Quit livin' in the past man! OK I think it's fair to compare SF3 : NG with Garou : MOTW since pulling out 3S is just unfair since capcom has had 3 goes at it and because of the larger character roster... Basically I can't see how you can compare these two games, I mean how can you say which one is better? They both have original character designs, they both have features which make them unique from most fighters. I mean the only thing that I can say is that MOTW has a easier learning curve than SF3, because of the easier Just Defend motion. Mostly people would compare the game on the level of enjoyment and competition they get from it, but that is relative really, I could say TIC-TAC-TOE was the best game in the world and you couldn't say anything to change my mind, simply because I like it. What I wanna know is; 1. Does MOTW have deeper gameplay than SF3? 2. Which looks cooler at high level play? - Muskau Posted by fomaman on 05:14:2001 02:37 PM: i'd say motw has equal depth to sf3 and that motw looks bettter at ANY level of game play. btw, LWK is a fucking riot. i'm thinking of going to the snk texas tourney just to kick his ass. for real. Posted by Diamond on 05:14:2001 02:42 PM: FINAL FIGHT IS THE BEST GAME VEVER Posted by SieClayton on 05:14:2001 03:01 PM: quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser Lets take a look at the very "original" capcom SF timeline sf2 sf2 champion edition sf2 bootlegs ssf2 ssf2 X sf the movie sf alpha sf alpha 2 sf alpha 3 then theres gold.... sf3 (damn they didnt studder to three) sf3 second impact sf 3 third strike sf ex plus alpha sf ex 2 sf ex 3 sf ex this is just naming a couple, damn if I were a capcom fan I would feel cheated right about now..... And then there is the endless character ripps made for the ultra easy to become and expert at vs series.....It kills me everytime!!!!! lets check out fatal fury ff1 ff2 ffs ff3 ffrb ffrbs ffrb2 garou...and wild ambition Wow it seems that FF actually takes some skill, good luck capcommies. And SNK doesnt suffer from sequalitis as bad as capcom, I think its about time that they made a newer shoto, OH SHIT DIDNT SEE THAT ONE COMING AHAHAHHAA!!!!! Oh crap! SNK had no pallette swap characters, they actually have to put work into there product!!!!! we have akuma, ryu, evil ryu, ken, sean ,dan, (aof rip off) whos next in the long line of the same character with different hair and clothes color.... Ryu, how original a character with a headband and a GI, LOL.... So while you guys are waiting for street fighter 3 minus a negative alpha plus omega, we have kof 2001 on the way! HAHAHA. Its amazing you need a title like a quadratic formula just to kick some ass, but if thats your only choice mash away heathens! How long can capcom profit off of the same damn thing over and over...I feel sorry for you guys.. They don't suffer from a whole lot of sequals, they just make a whole bunch of games with the same type moves. At least SF isn't suttle with their lazyness (LOL). I can at least say this about SNK and their games, they try new things and I commend them for that. But they keep fucking my character (Sie Kensou) over in every game and it's pissing me off. He hasn't been good since '95...oops sorry for my vent. Posted by Bastion on 05:14:2001 04:20 PM: quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa I always felt they did the best job with the Vampire/Darkstalkers series myself. I don't know though. I mean honestly, you and I both know that Adon and Birdie are from SF1 and Guy+Sodom are from Final Fight. Rose was actually GOING to be a Darkstalkers character but she was thrown into Alpha kind of at the last second. She ended up being my favorite Alpha character though. Anyways, I bring up the SF1 characters because they were in SF1, and I bring up the Final Fight characters because Final Fight, like Darkstalkers, is another game that FUNCTIONED on stereotypes. When I still lived in Brooklyn (and was extremely young) I used to swear that all the characters in Final Fight were based on actual people I had scene. Yes, there was a guy in a wheelchair with a handlebar 'stache lik Belgar! I originally put the asterik infront of Guy's name casue I was going to put a note at the end o my speech saying I was aware that some of these charactrs appeared in other games, but to simplify things, and create a fair basis (SNK fighters vs Capcom fighters) I would just refer to the characters first fighting game appearance. But i started to do that and forgot....so thats why it made no sense having the asterik there. quote: When I still lived in Brooklyn (and was extremely young) I used to swear that all the characters in Final Fight were based on actual people I had scene. Yes, there was a guy in a wheelchair with a handlebar 'stache lik Belgar! There is a difference between basing a character off of someone, and stereotyping someone. If it was a belief that all people in Brooklyn are in wheelchairs with handler bars...then Capcom did stereotype Brooklyner's. Posted by Drahktar on 05:14:2001 05:21 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui Oooppss...We have a winner. Sorry man, its damn near impossible to clean house with Remy, the competition for SF3 where you are must SUCK bad. Remy isnt a good chr, this is a fact. He has no realistic way of winning. Just more proof that you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to Capcom games. If you want to argue with me about SF3 and why Remy isnt good please do, but im telling you right now you wont win. This is EXACTLY why I like SNK fighters better than Capcom fighters, and why Garou is better than SF3. Posted by Psycho Soldier on 05:14:2001 06:28 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui [QUOTE]Originally posted by VManOfMana "Fatal Fury Fatal Fury 2 Fatal Fury Special Fatal Fury 3 Real Bout Fatal Fury" You forget Real Bout Fatal Fury Special and RB2. Fatal Fury Special bieng a shameless upgrade to fatal fury 2 and RB special bieng the same for Real Bout. Face it Krauser every company does it. Why do you think they release upgrades? To improve on the games past mistakes to make players happy and to make more money.If SNK fanboys were actually critical about the truly bad SNK fighters(they would say every SNK game is god just to make themselves feel better about the $300 they spent on it), and actually noticed all the bugs, glitches, infinites and such in these games and tell SNK about it then they would release upgrades to the game as well. Hell, considering SNK needs the money right now that would be a good idea. Hey Kaumi... you certainly know how to cause the controversey, don't ya? FFS is a much needed sequal to the series, just as was SFIIT was to the SF series. Because of FFS, characters that we all know and love now became forces to deal with. Character rankings were altered dramamtically. Sure, the game pretty much played like FF2, but the new tweaks to the system made it essential. Same thing goes from FF2 to RB... except the changes in the system were even more dramatic. Besides the alleged death of Geese, the system adapted the whole idea of chain combo and ring outs, as well as introducing a bunch of new characers. And yes, I do think some of the SNK fighters "suck ass". Galaxy Fight, Savage Reign, Fight Fever, 3 Count Bout... I wouldn't spend a cent for these titles. However, I would pay the exuberent amount of $200+ to get an exact arcade duplicate of a game I will enjoy... hence why I have all the KOFs. Does this classify me as a fanboy? Posted by moonslash-dan on 05:14:2001 06:56 PM: quote: [i] Ouch, to bad i may never know how good you really are. Hey wait, are you going to the SNK tourney in Texas? I hope so... [/B] wow, they have SNK tourneys in texas? thats cool, i wished they had SNK tourneys over here in Philly. what games are included in the SNK tourney? Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 07:01 PM: "FFS is a much needed sequal to the series, just as was SFIIT was to the SF series. Because of FFS, characters that we all know and love now became forces to deal with. Character rankings were altered dramamtically. Sure, the game pretty much played like FF2, but the new tweaks to the system made it essential." THATS EXACTLY WHAT IM TRYING TO SAY! However Krauser thinks otherwise when it comes to SF. The games needed upgrades and we got them. However i can sit here and say FFRBS is a rehash of FFRB just like any SNK fan can say Hyper Fighting is rehash to World Warrior. Krauser is looking for things to bash. "Galaxy Fight, Savage Reign, Fight Fever, 3 Count Bout..." Galaxy Fighter and Savage Reign are not SNK games, and Galaxy fight was a pretty good game. As for 3 count bout i dont even know if it was a SNK game or not.... Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 07:04 PM: Excuse me, you have no idea what your talking about. You realize that there is a MAJOR chr balance issue in MOTW, just like there is in every fighter. Kevin Ryan, Gato, and B.jenet are blatantly top tier(and have been anounced so numerous times). Get your facts strait, games will have chr balance issues. Yes im sounding harsh, i know. quote: Originally posted by Drahktar This is EXACTLY why I like SNK fighters better than Capcom fighters, and why Garou is better than SF3. Posted by ImMature on 05:14:2001 07:08 PM: Actually we the SNK fans don't have to waste our time trying to find "all the bugs, glitches, infinites and such" in our games...cuz Kamui has apparently devoted his life to have this task done for us Kamui, the difference between your attitude towards SNK and Yojimbo's or mine towards Crapcom is ZERO Posted by Blank Dave on 05:14:2001 07:09 PM: quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser Your such the idiot, I am entitled to my opinion, and if your ashamed to be and snk fan then take a hike, do you actually think telling me to go away will really make me go away???? MORONIC. I'ld like to respond to this, witha quote, Wolfgang, tell me if it sounds familiar. quote: Originally posted by WolfgangKrauser and what good does calling me and idiot accomplish? Well for one the more signs of weakness you show the less sense you will make. If capcom can make a product influneced by the fans then bring it forward. Posted by Drahktar on 05:14:2001 07:13 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui Excuse me, you have no idea what your talking about. You realize that there is a MAJOR chr balance issue in MOTW, just like there is in every fighter. Kevin Ryan, Gato, and B.jenet are blatantly top tier(and have been anounced so numerous times). Get your facts strait, games will have chr balance issues. Yes im sounding harsh, i know. Um, MAJOR? You're on crack. I cannot think of a single match-up in that game where one character owns another for free. Also, are you aware that Taiwan tournies are won more often by Dong Hwan than any other character? Tizoc wins a lot too, so apparently I'm not the only one who needs to get their facts straight. Posted by Blank Dave on 05:14:2001 07:23 PM: quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa Bastion: Don't take WolfgangKrauser seriously, I think I already mentioned that he's just a random sociopath who has way too much money to spend. Thanks Neo, I needed a laugh. Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 07:24 PM: I would like to remind everybody that Drahktar is not from Taiwan, he is from Minnesota. Let me guess, you saw 1 person win a tourney with Dong Hwan over a video and you assume Dong Hwan is top tier right? Whether Dong Hwan is a good chr or not, there IS a chr balance issue, EVERY FIGHTER HAS ONE. If someone won with Dong Hwan then the player playing him is exceptional. The top tier has already been set, its there for a reason, but some people are stubborn and good enough to win with other chrs. You cant think of any bad match ups eh? Pick Kevin Ryan against anybody, you have a bad match up. quote: Originally posted by Drahktar Um, MAJOR? You're on crack. I cannot think of a single match-up in that game where one character owns another for free. Also, are you aware that Taiwan tournies are won more often by Dong Hwan than any other character. Tizoc wins a lot too, so apparently I'm not the only one who needs to get their facts straight. Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 07:25 PM: "Actually we the SNK fans don't have to waste our time trying to find "all the bugs, glitches, infinites and such" in our games...cuz Kamui has apparently devoted his life to have this task done for us" And what makes you think i do? More assumptions? "Kamui, the difference between your attitude towards SNK and Yojimbo's or mine towards Crapcom is ZERO" 1 major difference, I ACTUALLY PLAY SNK GAMES. You dont touch Capcom games or dont play them enough to give them the time of day. Posted by Drahktar on 05:14:2001 08:22 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui I would like to remind everybody that Drahktar is not from Taiwan, he is from Minnesota. Let me guess, you saw 1 person win a tourney with Dong Hwan over a video and you assume Dong Hwan is top tier right? Whether Dong Hwan is a good chr or not, there IS a chr balance issue, EVERY FIGHTER HAS ONE. If someone won with Dong Hwan then the player playing him is exceptional. The top tier has already been set, its there for a reason, but some people are stubborn and good enough to win with other chrs. You cant think of any bad match ups eh? Pick Kevin Ryan against anybody, you have a bad match up. As much fun as it would be to explain my sounces, I'm not going to bother. Having a fight over who's sources are more acurate doesn't sound appealing to me. As for bad match-ups, how about you explain why Kevin vs anybody is a bad match-up. Let's say Kevin vs Terry. How exactly does Kevin own Terry for free? Posted by O.Ryoga on 05:14:2001 08:52 PM: quote: Originally posted by Drahktar As much fun as it would be to explain my sounces, I'm not going to bother. Having a fight over who's sources are more acurate doesn't sound appealing to me. As for bad match-ups, how about you explain why Kevin vs anybody is a bad match-up. Let's say Kevin vs Terry. How exactly does Kevin own Terry for free? Do you read people's minds? Kamui does. That's how he has a reliable source. Hell, Kamui even talks about 3S when it's popular knowledge that US players are clueless about that game (compared to the Japs). Posted by PrOzErG on 05:14:2001 09:13 PM: quote: Originally posted by EndLeSS8 Yea! It's me... I got sick and tired of all that crap with the Devils, and Fran, and all that. It just didn't "flow" right. At least here, I can have some decent conversation, and most of the ppl I know are here. Seeya around! (BTW, nice first post! LOL!) l8z THANKS !! another thing were do you update your profile LOL ? Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 09:20 PM: I KNEW YOU WOULD SAY THAT!!! :P Yes we are clueless about the game alright. You dont really know what your talking about consider that you never saw the USA vs Japan 3s matches, and you have probably never played anybody worth a shit in the game. Remember you dont like Capcom, i dont expect you to play any of there games. Im hoping you will call Hsien clueless when it comes to 3s. quote: Originally posted by O.Ryoga Do you read people's minds? Kamui does. That's how he has a reliable source. Hell, Kamui even talks about 3S when it's popular knowledge that US players are clueless about that game (compared to the Japs). Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 10:30 PM: Fair enough. kevin has a really good poke game, his standing B, Toward + B, QCB + A and Standing C, beat pretty much every one of Terry's pokes. Terry's only option against these pokes is his Power Dunk as he just cant out poke Kevin Ryan out of a foot game, it will eat whatever Kevin is sticking out IF timed correctly when Kevin is being careless. Unfortunately thats Terry's only viable answer to Kevins ground game other than the occasional crouching B as an attaempt to meet one of Kevin's poke attempts first, however Kevin has range in his favor so as long as he stays of Terrys poke distance with his own ground game then there isnt a problem.Terry can attempt to just defend a poke and counter, but most of terry's specials are very slow, and he cant deal alot of damage after a just defend without a super. Terry can also attempt to back dash through and away Kevins pokes(becuase backdashes in MOTW are stupidly invincible), but that only slowly puts himself into the corner where Kevin wants you to be and can apply the most pressure. This isnt taking into acount Kevin's confusion game consisting of his ground crawl, command throw, and QCF + D roll, which in all cases Terry's only options is to land a power dunk or a throw. Terry will have to knock Kevin down to apply any type of pressure on him, unfortunatly a smart MOTW player can do a quick get up(which is invincible as they roll out) if Terry did happen to knock Kevin down. If Terry tried a cross up D after a knock down then a quick get up would completely ruin that, if Terry attempts to stick out a early HP Power charge for a combo attempt then Kevin can throw him out of it after the quick recovery.This leaves Terry 1 realistic Option after a knock down. throw a LP Power wave and try to follow up after wards, although considering you can "just defend" the power wav for free thats not much help. Then we have Kevin's damage dealing potential, which is by far the best in the game. 1 combo from just a standing attack with a full bar earns him 90% for free(if for some reason he lands a full jump in he gets to kill you for 100%, which BTW there all very easy combos to begin with). Without a bar he still deals a solid 35-40% for every combo. His regular HP throw is also a perfect set up for a "fake" cross up(not sapposed to be an actual cross up, but, it does just that)....Kevin just downright has more options vs Terry. quote: Originally posted by Drahktar As much fun as it would be to explain my sounces, I'm not going to bother. Having a fight over who's sources are more acurate doesn't sound appealing to me. As for bad match-ups, how about you explain why Kevin vs anybody is a bad match-up. Let's say Kevin vs Terry. How exactly does Kevin own Terry for free? Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 11:12 PM: And yes, I do think some of the SNK fighters "suck ass". Galaxy Fight, Savage Reign, Fight Fever, 3 Count Bout... I wouldn't spend a cent for these titles. However, I would pay the exuberent amount of $200+ to get an exact arcade duplicate of a game I will enjoy... hence why I have all the KOFs. Galaxy Fight (which was actually pretty decent) and Fight Fever were not made by SNK. Axel Hawk was a Goerge Forman ripp not a butterbean rip.allthough both could be true. George Forman is very fit, he is also black. Butterbean is very fit but has a large stomach, he is also white. Axel Hawk is very fit, but has a large stomach, he is also white. 1. Does MOTW have deeper gameplay than SF3? 2. Which looks cooler at high level play? Honestly? I give this to Mark of the Wolves on both counts. It's because at the highest levels of play, Third Strike tends to degenerate into a kara-throwing fest, which looks boring. However because it's still an effective way to play many people stick with it, allowing any potential depth Third Strike could have to stagnate. Also in Garou you tend to have to use ALL of your characters available normals and specials to consistently win, so it gives more overall variety to a lot of the matches. Um, MAJOR? You're on crack. I cannot think of a single match-up in that game where one character owns another for free. Also, are you aware that Taiwan tournies are won more often by Dong Hwan than any other character? Tizoc wins a lot too, so apparently I'm not the only one who needs to get their facts straight. I have to agree with this, IMO Tizzoc and Kevin Rian are the ONLY characters that might be considered overpowered, and even then a good player knows how to take them down. I would like to remind everybody that Drahktar is not from Taiwan, he is from Minnesota. And you're from Texas, remember? What's your point? Let me guess, you saw 1 person win a tourney with Dong Hwan over a video and you assume Dong Hwan is top tier right? blah blah blah blah If you actually read what he said you'd realize that he's saying that there IS NO top tier in it because the game is extremely balanced. He brought up Dong Hwan being a winner in Taiwanese tournaments to illustrate that even the characters which don't get too much use or SEEM underpowered to the naked eye can still come out on top. EVERY FIGHTER HAS ONE. This is a pretty close-minded statement. I think it's probably holding you back from reaching your potential with many fighting game characters. Pick Kevin Ryan against anybody, you have a bad match up. Kevin Rian vs. Kain R. Heinlein. Seriously though, even Kevin can be taken down if you can figure out your opponent's pattern. You'll probably lose the first round 'figuring it out,' but by then you'll be able to put up a good fight in the second round and, if you're skilled enough, win round 3. You still haven't told me what my purpose is here yet. Posted by Akuma2002 on 05:14:2001 11:20 PM: kevin ryan is awsome kain is the worst last boss ever to be made i don`t see how anyone could lose to him even in the third round Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 11:24 PM: *LOL* I meant to say earlier that he suffers from Orochi syndrome. He is EXTREMELY powerful, but his AI is crap. Posted by TS on 05:14:2001 11:29 PM: quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa I always felt they did the best job with the Vampire/Darkstalkers series myself. Alpha brought use *Guy, Adon, Rose, Sodom, Charlie, Birdie. I don't know though. I mean honestly, you and I both know that Adon and Birdie are from SF1 and Guy+Sodom are from Final Fight. Rose was actually GOING to be a Darkstalkers character but she was thrown into Alpha kind of at the last second. I'm like 90% sure this is heresay. The bit about Rose, I mean. Posted by Drahktar on 05:14:2001 11:31 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui Fair enough. kevin has a really good poke game, his standing B, Toward + B, QCB + A and Standing C, beat pretty much every one of Terry's pokes. Terry's only option against these pokes is his Power Dunk as he just cant out poke Kevin Ryan out of a foot game, it will eat whatever Kevin is sticking out IF timed correctly when Kevin is being careless. Unfortunately thats Terry's only viable answer to Kevins ground game other than the occasional crouching B as an attaempt to meet one of Kevin's poke attempts first, however Kevin has range in his favor so as long as he stays of Terrys poke distance with his own ground game then there isnt a problem.Terry can attempt to just defend a poke and counter, but most of terry's specials are very slow, and he cant deal alot of damage after a just defend without a super. Terry can also attempt to back dash through and away Kevins pokes(becuase backdashes in MOTW are stupidly invincible), but that only slowly puts himself into the corner where Kevin wants you to be and can apply the most pressure. Okay, Terry has a couple options you left out. First, his Power Wave can be quite effective in poke games. Second, and more importantly, Terry can Burning Knuckle out of a Just Defend with good speed. Fast enough that Kevin can't block after throwing a standing B, his fastest poke. quote: This isnt taking into acount Kevin's confusion game consisting of his ground crawl, command throw, and QCF + D roll, which in all cases Terry's only options is to land a power dunk or a throw. A third option is to avoid those. All of them are very easily evaded. The other two options you listed for Terry work fine as well. quote: Terry will have to knock Kevin down to apply any type of pressure on him, unfortunatly a smart MOTW player can do a quick get up(which is invincible as they roll out) if Terry did happen to knock Kevin down. If Terry tried a cross up D after a knock down then a quick get up would completely ruin that, if Terry attempts to stick out a early HP Power charge for a combo attempt then Kevin can throw him out of it after the quick recovery.This leaves Terry 1 realistic Option after a knock down. throw a LP Power wave and try to follow up after wards, although considering you can "just defend" the power wav for free thats not much help. Just defended or not the pressure is still there. Terry can also pressure him with power waves, hop kicks and light burning knuckles. Terry also works fine under pressure. quote: Then we have Kevin's damage dealing potential, which is by far the best in the game. 1 combo from just a standing attack with a full bar earns him 90% for free(if for some reason he lands a full jump in he gets to kill you for 100%, which BTW there all very easy combos to begin with). Without a bar he still deals a solid 35-40% for every combo. His regular HP throw is also a perfect set up for a "fake" cross up(not sapposed to be an actual cross up, but, it does just that).... I'll give you that. But the 90%-100% damage combos you speak of must be done in the corner (unless there is something I don't know about), which won't happen. quote: Kevin just downright has more options vs Terry. Naw, they're just different. Which is why I like the game. Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 11:37 PM: "I have to agree with this, IMO Tizzoc and Kevin Rian are the ONLY characters that might be considered overpowered, and even then a good player knows how to take them down." Like i said, its quite well known that(or thought it everyone knew) Kevin(1), Gato(2), and B,Jenet(3), are the best chrs in the game(apparently.). I dont think Tizzoc is overpowering, i dont have a problem against him myself... "If you actually read what he said you'd realize that he's saying that there IS NO top tier in it because the game is extremely balanced. He brought up Dong Hwan being a winner in Taiwanese tournaments to illustrate that even the characters which don't get too much use or SEEM underpowered to the naked eye can still come out on top." That has to do with the players potential, not the chr. Maybe Dong Hwan is a better chr then originally believed, but that deosnt mean there arent imbalances. To say the MOTW is a better balanced game then SF3 is PURE speculation. "This is a pretty close-minded statement. I think it's probably holding you back from reaching your potential with many fighting game characters." Closed minded? Closed minded is thinking that fighting game developers have the power to make perfectly balanced fighting games when its simply IMPOSSIBLE. Its impossible to make the perfect piece of art, its impossible to throw the perfect pitch, and its impossible the perfect fighter.You simply cant say MOTW is a well balanced game when there are obviously better chrs that stand out on top(whether or not a good player can win with slightly worse chrs). Every fighter has its imbalances, the people that dont see them are lying to themselves. "Kevin Rian vs. Kain R. Heinlein. Seriously though, even Kevin can be taken down if you can figure out your opponent's pattern. You'll probably lose the first round 'figuring it out,' but by then you'll be able to put up a good fight in the second round and, if you're skilled enough, win round 3." You can say that for any chr in any incredibly unbalanced fighter! Thats only proof that its the players intervention thats deciding whether or not a seemingly lesser chr could win against a better one. "You still haven't told me what my purpose is here yet. " I figured you were under the same impression as Endless was since the fall of ON.com. But im no mind reader(despite popular belief), you tell me. [/B][/QUOTE] Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 11:51 PM: "Okay, Terry has a couple options you left out. First, his Power Wave can be quite effective in poke games. Second, and more importantly, Terry can Burning Knuckle out of a Just Defend with good speed. Fast enough that Kevin can't block after throwing a standing B, his fastest poke." His Power Wave isnt that effective, it leads to me just defending it and countering, its the same problem SF3 has. And a LP burn knuckle can be blocked if you just defend Ryan's standing be then guard cancel into it, if Kevin is at the right distance(where he should be in the first place). "A third option is to avoid those. All of them are very easily evaded. The other two options you listed for Terry work fine as well." LOL, just saying to "avoid those" is easier said then done when those tactics are backed by a good player who hides his attempts. And the 2 options i listed arent fine, there very risky and can lead to free bashing from kevin. Assuming the Terry player is good, he will get 1 chance to deal damage in that kind of situation. "Just defended or not the pressure is still there. Terry can also pressure him with power waves, hop kicks and light burning knuckles. Terry also works fine under pressure." Just defending a projectile then guard canceling into his crawl, low variation equals a free knockdown for Kevin. Terry's A+B hop kick is USELESS. very slow, very easy to see coming, and very easy to counter(just hit standing A :P )Oh, and tossing out random light Burn Knuckles is a DEATH WISH. "Naw, they're just different. Which is why I like the game." I like the game too, but your ignoring the fact that the game has chr inbalances, just like every other fighter. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 11:52 PM: Blah blah blah blah blah Closed minded? Closed minded is thinking that fighting game developers have the power to make perfectly balanced fighting games when its simply IMPOSSIBLE. Its impossible to make the perfect piece of art, its impossible to throw the perfect pitch, and its impossible the perfect fighter.You simply cant say MOTW is a well balanced game when there are obviously better chrs that stand out on top(whether or not a good player can win with slightly worse chrs). Every fighter has its imbalances, the people that dont see them are lying to themselves. Why is it impossible to make a balanced fighting game? Posted by Kamui on 05:14:2001 11:53 PM: If he was aloud in tournies no one playing him could possibly lose. A projectile as good as his with only a 1 second charge is just retarded. quote: Originally posted by Neo Rasa *LOL* I meant to say earlier that he suffers from Orochi syndrome. He is EXTREMELY powerful, but his AI is crap. Posted by Neo Rasa on 05:14:2001 11:56 PM: Who cares about his projectile? I like his anti-air stuff and his charge down~Ja Ei Ken style move. It keeps people guessing whenever you're in a crouching position Posted by Drahktar on 05:14:2001 11:57 PM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui That has to do with the players potential, not the chr. Maybe Dong Hwan is a better chr then originally believed, but that deosnt mean there arent imbalances. To say the MOTW is a better balanced game then SF3 is PURE speculation. Sure it's more balanced. No one gets owned for free. quote: Closed minded? Closed minded is thinking that fighting game developers have the power to make perfectly balanced fighting games when its simply IMPOSSIBLE. Its impossible to make the perfect piece of art, its impossible to throw the perfect pitch, and its impossible the perfect fighter.You simply cant say MOTW is a well balanced game when there are obviously better chrs that stand out on top(whether or not a good player can win with slightly worse chrs). Every fighter has its imbalances, the people that dont see them are lying to themselves. Yes, you CAN say MOTW is well balanced. As a matter of fact I'm saying it right now. MOTW is a well balanced game. No one said it was perfectly balanced. I do think you are being close minded. Just because one character is easy to do good with, and another character is extremely hard to do good with, does NOT mean that they're unbalanced. Cable is a good example of an easy to be good with character who is not the best. Anyway, you know what I'm saying. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 12:06 AM: First off i would appreciate it if you would stop with the "blah blah blah" crap already :P "Why is it impossible to make a balanced fighting game?" Second, humans are flawed, we are inperfect biengs and everything we make is inperfect. All the tweaking in the world will not get you a perfectly balanced fighter. There are too many variables when it comes to human play to even decide when you would have a perfectly balanced fighter. Hell the top tier rankings i suplied could vary much be somewhat untrue even if from a reliable source becuase of those variables, but thats just another sign that its impossible to make a perfectly balanced fighter. You think way too much of humans, nothing is perfect and the chr balance in a fighter wont be the first thing to be perfected. Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 12:12 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui LOL, just saying to "avoid those" is easier said then done when those tactics are backed by a good player who hides his attempts. And the 2 options i listed arent fine, there very risky and can lead to free bashing from kevin. Assuming the Terry player is good, he will get 1 chance to deal damage in that kind of situation. Ok, Kevin jailbreaks = Terry jumps over him, Kevin rolls = Terry throws him. quote: Just defending a projectile then guard canceling into his crawl, low variation equals a free knockdown for Kevin. Terry's A+B hop kick is USELESS. very slow, very easy to see coming, and very easy to counter(just hit standing A :P )Oh, and tossing out random light Burn Knuckles is a DEATH WISH. Not THAT hop kick. I mean low jumps into D kick. I didn't say to toss out random burn knuckles. Just defending his ground wave into jailbreak? Terry can just hop back once and he's free from danger. Also, EVERYTHING (cept throws) can be just defended and punished. I could just say that Terry should just defend everything and then hit Kevin, but that's just dumb. quote: I like the game too, but your ignoring the fact that the game has chr inbalances, just like every other fighter. I am not ignoring this fact. It's just that Garou has very GOOD balance. Once again, no once said it was perfect. Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 12:15 AM: BTW, a PERFECTLY balanced fighter is definetly within human grasp. A very easy, less fun way to do so would be to make only one generic character. No character selection, you just get to play that one guy. Maybe you can choose your costume or something. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 12:24 AM: "Sure it's more balanced. No one gets owned for free. I do think you are being close minded. Just because one character is easy to do good with, and another character is extremely hard to do good with, does NOT mean that they're unbalanced. Cable is a good example of an easy to be good with character who is not the best. Anyway, you know what I'm saying." You could say the same about ANY fighter, including SF3! That completely depends on the player. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 12:40 AM: "Ok, Kevin jailbreaks = Terry jumps over him, Kevin rolls = Terry throws him." Again, your assuming that you even see it and The Kevin player doe that blindly. "Not THAT hop kick. I mean low jumps into D kick. I didn't say to toss out random burn knuckles." You wont be jumping through Kevin's poke game i assure you. No you didnt say too toss out random burn knuckes, you said "pressure them with Burn Knuckles". Now applying pressure deosnt mean actually hitting them, and if a burn knuckle is blocked you eat a free combo. Using the Burn Knuckle to apply pressure isnt valid or safe. "Just defending his ground wave into jailbreak? Terry can just hop back once and he's free from danger. Also, EVERYTHING (cept throws) can be just defended and punished." YOU CANT. I just guard canceled your projectile, your in a fireball stun, i nailed you for free, you CANT hop back and out of a fireball stun. "I am not ignoring this fact. It's just that Garou has very GOOD balance. Once again, no once said it was perfect." But its no better than most of the fighters out there, i promise you. Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 12:40 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui "Sure it's more balanced. No one gets owned for free. I do think you are being close minded. Just because one character is easy to do good with, and another character is extremely hard to do good with, does NOT mean that they're unbalanced. Cable is a good example of an easy to be good with character who is not the best. Anyway, you know what I'm saying." You could say the same about ANY fighter, including SF3! That completely depends on the player. Um, you said yourself that that wasn't true for SF3. Here it is: "Remy isnt a good chr, this is a fact. He has no realistic way of winning." Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 12:46 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui "Ok, Kevin jailbreaks = Terry jumps over him, Kevin rolls = Terry throws him." Again, your assuming that you even see it and The Kevin player doe that blindly. Well, you can't beat any character if the player is perfect. quote: "Just defending his ground wave into jailbreak? Terry can just hop back once and he's free from danger. Also, EVERYTHING (cept throws) can be just defended and punished." YOU CANT. I just guard canceled your projectile, your in a fireball stun, i nailed you for free, you CANT hop back and out of a fireball stun. "Also, EVERYTHING (cept throws) can be just defended and punished." Wasn't supposed to be tied into the ground wave argument. Just in general. You're also assuming that I'm close enough for retaliation. quote: But its no better than most of the fighters out there, i promise you. Most eh? Name 3. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 12:47 AM: "Um, you said yourself that that wasn't true for SF3. Here it is: "Remy isnt a good chr, this is a fact. He has no realistic way of winning."" Yeah except im sure a good player could win a few games with him. That means the game is balanced :/ See how easy it is to speculate? quote: Originally posted by Drahktar Um, you said yourself that that wasn't true for SF3. Here it is: "Remy isnt a good chr, this is a fact. He has no realistic way of winning." Posted by PrOzErG on 05:15:2001 01:30 AM: Seems that Streeth Figther 3 owns Garou right now I will give my 2 cents when the post will stop to have replys ! Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 01:30 AM: ""Also, EVERYTHING (cept throws) can be just defended and punished." Wasn't supposed to be tied into the ground wave argument. Just in general. You're also assuming that I'm close enough for retaliation." If your not close enough for retaliation then i can jump over it knowing you cant retaliate as well. Just another stalemate. "Most eh? Name 3." No, cuase i will NOT make a comment based off of pure speculation. YOU can say a fighter is balanced all you want, but that means zero when good players play bad chrs. Personal experience means little when a large group of tourney players that played the game more than anybody get together and decide what the rankings should be. But whos to say there right. Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 01:33 AM: Ok, maybe I didn't post enough of your quote last time. quote: Originally posted by Kamui Oooppss...We have a winner. Sorry man, its damn near impossible to clean house with Remy, the competition for SF3 where you are must SUCK bad. Remy isnt a good chr, this is a fact. He has no realistic way of winning. Just more proof that you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to Capcom games. If you want to argue with me about SF3 and why Remy isnt good please do, but im telling you right now you wont win. So what's wrong with him winning with Remy? You just said that you can win with him if you're good, but that doesn't seem to flow from your previous argument. So, which is it? Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 01:37 AM: It takes an exceptional player to win with a bad chr, and i know Krauser isnt one of them(nether am i). Nobody who hates Capcom fighters as much as he does would good get good at one. However i should refraised what i said, its VERY VERY HARD, and IMPROBABLE that someone could land winning streaks with a chr like Remy. I posted that paragraph mearly to show that krauser knows jack shit about SF3. "So what's wrong with him winning with Remy? You just said that you can win with him if you're good, but that doesn't seem to flow from your previous argument. So, which is it?" Posted by ImMature on 05:15:2001 01:47 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui "Actually we the SNK fans don't have to waste our time trying to find "all the bugs, glitches, infinites and such" in our games...cuz Kamui has apparently devoted his life to have this task done for us" And what makes you think i do? More assumptions? Well it's pretty much all you do in *every* bbs 1 major difference, I ACTUALLY PLAY SNK GAMES. You dont touch Capcom games or dont play them enough to give them the time of day. [/B][/QUOTE] That's an assumption. We play Crapcom games too quote: Originally posted by Kamui Closed minded? Closed minded is thinking that fighting game developers have the power to make perfectly balanced fighting games when its simply IMPOSSIBLE. Its impossible to make the perfect piece of art, its impossible to throw the perfect pitch, and its impossible the perfect fighter.You simply cant say MOTW is a well balanced game when there are obviously better chrs that stand out on top(whether or not a good player can win with slightly worse chrs). Every fighter has its imbalances, the people that dont see them are lying to themselves. OH MY GOD WOTAN!!!111!!! Who the fuck is talking about "Perfect Balance" here AT ALL? We're just expecting balance in fighters TO SOME DEGREE, that's all Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 02:01 AM: Ok. What I'm saying is that MOTW has no bad characters. Some are easier to learn and use effectivly, some are hard, but they all are very, VERY playable. Here's a different analogy (the Cable one obviously didn't get my point across): Take a car with automatic transmission vs an older car with manual transmission. Anyone who can drive can drive an automatic well, while it takes more skill to use a manual transmission. They both do their job equally as well but one is harder to use than the other. That's how Garou's characters are. Some are easier to play, but none are any better. Of course the games balance isn't perfect, but it is MUCH more balanced than any fighter I've played recently. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 02:02 AM: "Well it's pretty much all you do in *every* bbs" All i do is find glitches/bugs/infinites on every BBS? That deosnt make a lot of sense... "That's an assumption. We play Crapcom games too" Thats a downright lie, your telling me you play MvC2 or even SF in general? You mentioned in passed arguments that you dont really play Capcom games. "OH MY GOD WOTAN!!!111!!! Who the fuck is talking about "Perfect Balance" here AT ALL? We're just expecting balance in fighters TO SOME DEGREE, that's all" THEN THAT WOULD MEAN IM RIGHT AND KEVIN RYAN IS THE BEST CHR IN THE GAME. Balance to SOME DEGREE means the game ISNT balanced, dont you know what balanced means? Even if the chr balance is decent, that still means inbalance is still there. Oh, and who the hell is WOTAN???? :P [/B][/QUOTE] Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 02:09 AM: I understand what your trying to say, and that applies to some chrs, but not any game in a whole. Your talking about chr depth vs reward factor. Well Kevin Ryan isnt a hard chr to learn yet he has a high reward factor, this especially goes for B.Jenet. Its really pathetic that a chr like B.Jenet has a higher standing then Rock Howard, whos a much harder chr to learn how to play. I dont agree with you, and i think your giving MOTW too much credit, but i cant change your mind...Lets just agree to disagree..... quote: Originally posted by Drahktar Ok. What I'm saying is that MOTW has no bad characters. Some are easier to learn and use effectivly, some are hard, but they all are very, VERY playable. Here's a different analogy (the Cable one obviously didn't get my point across): Take a car with automatic transmission vs an older car with manual transmission. Anyone who can drive can drive an automatic well, while it takes more skill to use a manual transmission. They both do their job equally as well but one is harder to use than the other. That's how Garou's characters are. Some are easier to play, but none are any better. Of course the games balance isn't perfect, but it is MUCH more balanced than any fighter I've played recently. Posted by ImMature on 05:15:2001 02:15 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui All i do is find glitches/bugs/infinites on every BBS? That deosnt make a lot of sense... *Sigh* no I mean all you do in every bbs is posting about the glitches/bugs/infinites you've found in SNK fighters. Too bad that you never find that kinda stuff in XvsSF or MvC1 or 2 for example. Only in SNK games... quote: Originally posted by Kamui Thats a downright lie, your telling me you play MvC2 or even SF in general? You mentioned in passed arguments that you dont really play Capcom games. What?? All I said is that I don't play SF nearly as much as I play SNK fighters. And it's true, I'm mostly a KOFer. But that's different from "not really playing Capcom games", now isn't it? quote: Originally posted by Kamui THEN THAT WOULD MEAN IM RIGHT AND KEVIN RYAN IS THE BEST CHR IN THE GAME. Balance to SOME DEGREE means the game ISNT balanced, dont you know what balanced means? Even if the chr balance is decent, that still means inbalance is still there. Errr are you trying to confuse my little non-native English-speaking self here? What do you mean with "the char balance is decent" then? Shouldn't you be saying "the char inbalance is decent instead"? Ok anyways you know what I mean, dontcha? quote: Originally posted by Kamui Oh, and who the hell is WOTAN???? :P He's the chief god in Norse Mythology, the one that will lead us SNK players to Valhalla when we die Posted by Drahktar on 05:15:2001 02:19 AM: quote: Originally posted by Kamui I understand what your trying to say, and that applies to some chrs, but not any game in a whole. Your talking about chr depth vs reward factor. Well Kevin Ryan isnt a hard chr to learn yet he has a high reward factor, this especially goes for B.Jenet. Its really pathetic that a chr like B.Jenet has a higher standing then Rock Howard, whos a much harder chr to learn how to play. I dont agree with you, and i think your giving MOTW too much credit, but i cant change your mind...Lets just agree to disagree..... Ah well, guess I'm cool with that. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 03:15 AM: YAY!! quote: Originally posted by Drahktar Ah well, guess I'm cool with that. Posted by Kamui on 05:15:2001 03:48 AM: Well i was hoping the argument would end so ill make this short. "*Sigh* no I mean all you do in every bbs is posting about the glitches/bugs/infinites you've found in SNK fighters. Too bad that you never find that kinda stuff in XvsSF or MvC1 or 2 for example. Only in SNK games..." That art of fighting bug and the KOF OTG throw bug are the only bugs i have ever posted about that dealt with a SNK game. I try to clean out every fighter i play, im sure youve noticed with the recent CvS combo vid me and a friend did on this very site. Im also quite sure that Mike Z takes care of showing off all the glitches in fighters like MvC2. "What?? All I said is that I don't play SF nearly as much as I play SNK fighters. And it's true, I'm mostly a KOFer. But that's different from "not really playing Capcom games", now isn't it?" I have a feeling that you havent played most o those games for more than 10 minutes, but anywho, fine whatever. The way you talk about Capcom games no one would ever know you did. "Errr are you trying to confuse my little non-native English-speaking self here? What do you mean with "the char balance is decent" then? Shouldn't you be saying "the char inbalance is decent instead"? " No Einstein :P But i dont want to start the argument back up so im gonna avoid this. "Ok anyways you know what I mean, dontcha?" yes. "He's the chief god in Norse Mythology, the one that will lead us SNK players to Valhalla when we die " LOL! Ok :P Posted by Shock Mega X on 05:15:2001 05:18 AM: Soon the Valkeries will reawaken, and you will witness the might of my awesome army at Ragnarok, where the end of the world will commence. Doom to all! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Posted by Akuma2002 on 05:15:2001 05:22 AM: another thread that went nowhere :P All times are GMT. The time now is 10:23 PM. 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